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marriage

Religious leaders: Gay marriage a peril to liberty

Nearly 40 religious leaders, including Catholic, evangelical, Jewish and Mormon figures, issued an open letter Thursday that argues that the battle against same-sex marriage is a fight on behalf of religious freedom.

“Marriage and religious freedom are both deeply woven into the fabric of this nation,” clergy members wrote in their letter, “Marriage and Religious Freedom: Fundamental Goods That Stand or Fall Together.” It calls on all Americans to promote and protect marriage “in its true definition.”

The “most urgent peril” associated with legalizing same-sex unions is that religious individuals and organizations would be forced or pressured to treat same-sex sexual conduct as the moral equivalent of marital sexual conduct, they explained.

These conflicts would arise in countless ways, “because altering the civil definition of ‘marriage’ does not change one law, but hundreds, even thousands, at once,” the clergy said. Already, religious people and groups are being labeled “bigots” and their activities and services punished or targeted because they believe marriage is only the union of one man and one woman.

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  • Wendell

    I have no argument with the article, but I try to be less emotional and more logical about what gay unions really mean. Think about it, what if all males were homosexual and all females became lesbians? In about 100 years there would be no people, except those produced in a petri dish in a laboratory or through arificial insemination, and that's no fun! The Bible is clear on this issue. These are acts against nature. Plaiinly stated it's a sin! It's an abomination and affront before God. Does anyone remember the biblical account of Sodom and Gomorrah and why God punished those cities?

    • daves

      Once again hogwash. There have been gay people forever, they are not a threat to anyone.

      I don't understand what liberty the churches think they are losing either. The liberty to discriminate? No one is making them accept gay marriage. No one is forcing them to perform the weddings. People may pressure them like they say but people have been pressuring churches and calling them bigots forever also. I really do not see anything changing for them.

      • daves

        I mean God made a commandment about keeping the Sabbath and not working but almost everyone ignores it. God did not make a commandment about homosexuality but everyone is so upset about it. Why?

        • Pastor Dwayne

          He commanded that they be killed

          • http://youtu.be/9p7fQD0eLb8 Despeville

            Did you kill some lately Dwayne?

          • http://rationalresponses.blogspot.com/ Jeff Dixon

            He has not shaken my house.

      • Wendell

        daves, I've read a lot of your babblings, and you are nothing more than a fool!

        • http://rationalresponses.blogspot.com/ Jeff Dixon

          It is always amazing how every Christian who believes differently than another Christian is a fool.

        • daves

          Well then please help me to understand Wendell. Why is homosexuality more sinful than the 4th commandment?

      • bighoss

        Gay men are indeed a THREAT, both to themselves and to their partners in illicit sexual activity. Often ignored in these discussions is the documented FACT that gay men are far, far more likely to contract a host of diseases, generally grouped under the descriptor, "gay bowel syndrome." Google it up and read about it and decide for yourself whether the gay way of life is harmless to society.

      • keyboardshark

        daves says: "No one is making them accept gay marriage. No one is forcing them to perform the weddings"

        Oh, really? "A ministry that follows the dictates of its faith is engaging in wrongdoing, according to a New Jersey judge who recommended today that the state Division on Civil Rights find the Ocean Grove Camp Meeting Association violated the state’s nondiscrimination law.
        “The respondent violated the [Law Against Discrimination] when it refused to conduct a civil-union ceremony for Ms. Bernstein and Ms. Paster,” wrote Solomon Metzger, an administrative law judge whose determination will become final if not overturned by the Division of Civil Rights.
        The seaside location has been popular for years for weddings, but the association, which is affiliated with the United Methodist Church, determined it could not biblically allow same-sex ceremonies to take place on its property.
        So when Harriet Bernstein and Luisa Paster signed up for such a ceremony, they were turned down. They filed the discrimination complaint, and the state’s Division on Civil Rights joined their cause." http://www.wnd.com/2012/01/judge-says-following-c…

        • msjallen

          We have reached a very sad and evil days in our country when ministers or churches or orgnizations are forced to go against God's Word for Civil Rights. This should never be done — it is the "State" or Fed Government ursurping God and our nation will be disciplined for it. It is because our churches have failed to teach the whole Word of God and multitudes of people are turning away from God to a meaningless life.

      • zappo777

        when you are burning in hell you tell me how much you support what God condemns

    • Steve

      Do you think you are likely to change and become homosexual? If you can't change, neither can they.
      If homosexuality is even partially genetic — as science is increasingly sure it is — then accepting homosexuals as a legitimate part of society and allowing them to marry would be a good idea. They would no longer feel they needed to marry a hetrosexual for protective coloration. Thus they would not produce children who carried the homosexual gene and in a generation or two there would be no more homosexuals.
      God punished Sodom and Gomorrah because he could not find even 10 righteous men in them. And their crime was attempted rape of guests they were bound to protect, not homosexuality in and of itself.

      • msjallen

        Homosexuals can change their behavior because it is a sin just like any other sin. It is more overt but many Christians are very arrogant and selfrighteous and very difficult to change their ways as well. If God says homosexuality is a sin then it is not a disease nor are they born that way and it can be overcome through the teaching, learning and application fo Bible Doctrine.

        • Steve

          Christians once thought the Bible said the world was flat, that the sun, the planets, and the stars all revolved around the earth, and that to lend money at interest violated God's laws. Once the astronomers and merchants convinced them they were wrong, Christians changed the way they interpreted the Bible.
          The Bible doesn't say anything about homosexuality, as neither the ancient Greeks nor Hebrews had developed the concept, let alone a word to describe it. English got along just fine without one, too, until the late 1800's. You'll probably never change you mind about homosexuals — facts can't change an opinion that wasn't based on facts to begin with — but your children (if any) already have.

          • msjallen

            Steve, you are straining at a nat and swallowing a camel. The "word" homosexual does not have to be in the Bible but the description is; plain and simple.
            READ: Geneses 19:5-8, Jude 7, Lev 18:22-23, Lev 20:13, 1Tim:9-10, & Romans 1:26-27
            I believe God's Word and teach my children and they teach their children and we all know what God says about homosexuality and believe His Word not yours or anyone else's.
            Jer 17:5 Thus says the LORD," Cursed is the man who trusts in mankind and makes flesh his strength, and whose heart turns away from the LORD.

          • heath3435

            First Steve where in the Bible it says that the world is flat?

            Second. The bible does say that man on man is a sin and woman on woman as well.
            Leviticus 18

      • zappo777

        full of crapola!!!!

    • RonT

      As a Christian, I believe that the return of Christ will be due to the immorality of the earth. Why was there the great flood? The people had turned from God so bad it wasn't tolerable any longer. Sodom and Gomorrah the issue was men desiring men, to the point that when Lot offer is daughter's they refuse and wanted the Angels, for this very reason the will return!

  • thisisit

    So again the Christian leaders cave. You know that God does not approve of homosexual acts but you are giving into the pressure. Do you really think God would approve of the way you are acting? Ask yourself that question then go to prayer.

    • Linda F.

      Thank God for the Christian leaders who refuse to cave.

  • Kalev

    Leviticus 20:13 (NASU), "If there is a man who lies with a male as those who lie with a woman, both of them have committed a detestable act; they shall surely be put to death. Their bloodguiltiness is upon them."
    God said it and that's all I need to know; it is a detestable act.

    • Davidmgus

      Paraphrasing Exodus 31:13-15…anyone who works on the Sabbath shall surely be put to death. So shall we organize stoning parties to stone to death all who work on the Sabbath?…Shall we start at the local hospital?…or maybe the grocery store…no I know… at the local fire station. Please advise.

    • http://rationalresponses.blogspot.com/ Jeff Dixon

      "Since all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God." (Romans 3:23) That's the verse I recall whenever someone uses the Bible to justify their own pet bias.

      • keyboardshark

        Jeff: Just because all have sinned, which is indeed true, does not mean that sin is OK.

        Homosexuality is definitely a sin, according to the Bible, but maybe it's not MY sin. In fact, it isn't. Doesn't interest me in the least. But I've got my own unique sin problems. Maybe that last post I made yesterday wasn't entirely kind to whomever I intended it. Maybe I didn't quite tell the truth when my wife asked if that dress made her look fat or not. And plenty others.

        But does that mean I cannot declare what the Bible says about homosexuality simply because I'm a sinner myself? No.

        But on the other hand, I shouldn't be spending too much time pointing out the sins of others if it makes me feel a little better about my own sins, which do not happen to include homosexuality. However, when a certain sin, such as homosexuality, (which is harmful to those who practice it as well as society as a whole) is being promoted as a virtue, then I have no choice but to take a stand against it.

  • Gatewood Galbraith

    I am not an advocate of homosexual anything. Neither do I condemn anyone. That's between them and God.

    Same sex Marriage
    It all depends upon what you definition of "marriage" is. Is your definition of marriage a union that is condoned, accepted, and blessed by God? Or, is your definition of marriage a civil license? In the later case, does the state have authority to restrict "marriage" to the union of a man and a woman?

    What needs to be recognized is that same sex marriage is a CIVIL matter, not a Godly matter.
    Godly marriage is a covenant with God. God is the third party in the marriage. Civil marriage is a contract with the state as the third party in the marriage. There is no provision in the Bible for same sex "marriage". It can be argued that it is not Godly.
    Perhaps the state should find another term to use other than "marriage" for the homosexual licensed union. Certainly the state has the right to define any word they use in the law.

    While we are on the subject, perhaps the churches should be advocates of Godly Marriage, and condemn civilly licensed marriages. What is the reasoning that the state should be involved in marriage in the first place. Marriage is a Godly union, based on the word of God. If I swear before God, in covenant with God, that cannot be broken. God will hold me to it. But if I want to get out of a marriage licensed by the state, the states says OK give me some money and it's done. Which one is more binding?

    Go look up the word "License" in a law dictionary. It's permission to do something that would otherwise be illegal.
    Is common law marriage Illegal? Were marriages less binding in past centuries when the only covenant was with God? No! The only reason for a state marriage license is to bring you under the control of the state. The only reason that the state wants control is to condone UN-Godly licentiousness, by state license. Since the beginning of mankind, some have always sought ways around the condemnation for sin.

    • d woods

      I totally agree with you. and for the record, Iam a minister and I would recognize and officiate at the union of either.
      God says HE IS TO JUDGE not us or the government. this includes ministers!! (and priests!)

      • Kalev

        If you are an ordained minister you should immediately return your ordination papers, homosexuallity is a SIN and you are aiding others to participate in SIN. Yes God is the judge but God's people do not participate in SIN in any form, way or manner, nor must we allow others participate in SIN. And I am an licensed minister as well, so I am within my rights as a minister to rebuke you for your stand on this matter, and I do this in a loving manner.

        • daves

          You don't sin? For sure, never anything?

          • Michael G.

            Daves–Shut up!

      • BohdanUke1

        Go to hell.

      • Strong Christian

        Judging the person is one thing, I have gay friends and relatives. They are very nice people, but judging their motive as a group is another. To shove it into my childrens face to make them accept it at an age that all they want to do is go and play with their friends, NO WAY! They past the line when they targeted the childrens because they know they can't change adults. What they do in their own home is one thing, but when they target innocent childrens in public schools and force the schools to teach that homosexualty is an alternative life style is totally wrong. KEEP IT OUT OF THE SCHOOLS! Let them make their own decisions when they become adults! Mr. Minister, if it is an abomination in GOD's eyes, you need to stand strong against it. You will answer for this on Judgement Day!

        • msjallen

          Strong Chistian, what you posted should be shouted loud and clear across every network and written in every newspaper and internet across this Nation until people wake up to the degrading of our society by homosexuals and their evil agenda; ESPECIALLY towards children. How sick can one be to tolerate this lifestyle.

      • Gatewood Galbraith

        Sorry, but I don't agree with you.
        If I were a minister, I wouldn't officiate at a homosexual union. Let the state do what it will, it will not be a marriage in the eyes of God. What did Christ do in the civil world ruled by Rome?
        If it came to a vote, I would vote against allowing homosexual unions. In our republic, we vote our conscience. I can condemn the practice, but I am commanded to love my fellow human beings.

    • msjallen

      If homosexuality is an abomination to God then it is an abomination to our society. Wherever Homosexuality is permitted in a society or nation, it is like a cancer and becomes one of the first manifestations of national degeneracy, national catastrophe, and the inevitable 5th Cycle of Discipline or destruction. There is an excellent reason for not tolerating homosexuality or lesbianism and it is obviously destructive to a nation. There is nothing more ghastly than the function of homosexuality and other perversions.

  • Ericcs

    Homosexuality is an abomination. It is Sin, Period. The wages of Sin is Death. Adultery is sin, Fornication is Sin, being a Drunkard is Sin, Lying is Sin, Greed and Covetousness is Sin; All these are Sins before the only True God. @ the day of Judgment, Jesus Christ is going to Judge people for there Sins especially for their rejection of his offer of salvation which could have saved them from ETERNAL DESTRUCTION, THINK ABOUT THAT, ETERNAL SEPARATION FROM THE SON OF GOD, Jesus can only save people from there Sins. Acts 4:12; John 14:6; John 3:36; 1 Cor 6:9; Rev 21:8; Jesus spoke about hell over 80 times in the New Testament alone. So let's pray for the Atheist, Agnostic, who have been deceived by Satan, believing there is no God,along with every Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist,Mormon, Jehovah's witness, Emergent Church leader, Universalist, and all of the rest of these false religions that come from the teachings of Satan, for many have been taken captive by him (Satan) doing his will. Oh yes, especially those so called Christians who continue to wash down and compromise God's word. They will pay a very heavy price. Fake Pastor's, Bishops,Evangelist,etc….

    • Laur

      U have hit the nail on the head. You r so right…

    • James

      I say amen to that.

  • Chris

    A bunch of clueless religious twerps who want control over people. Homosexuality is normal in many animal species.

    Yes – it's an affront to the cluelessness of religion.

    • Winston

      So, Chris, you are placing yourself on the same level of "many (other) animal species". Well if you see yourself lower than a human, then you are one. Stop self-justifying your lust for self-worship by sinning against God.

      • Kalev

        Winston, ignore this athiest, replying to him just gives him a platform to spew his atheistic rhetoric. He has already placed himself at the animalistic level by rejecting God and His Word.

    • Strong Republican

      You are a person who just speaks, but have no idea what he is saying. Please, before you post anything, reseach and know what you are talking about. People like you make debating boring. We need stimulating conversations!

    • Robert Koomans

      We farmers put any animal that turns out "gay" to the slaughterhouse, as IT IS THEN USELESS fo any other means except eating and using it's pelt. BUT, the issue I see about HOMOSEXUALITY enforced in LAW, is that it ends up hurting those who carry on the practice of raising families, children, and MORAL GUIDANCE, to name but a few. A NATION without moral guidance is a DOOMED Nation…. Just look through history! but NOW the USA and other Western countries are being PRESSURED by the U.N. to put in place laws that will PROMOTE IMMORALITY, and that means LAWS, which will end up being BY-LAWED so many times until the law punishes NORMAL behavior as GOD DEFINED. In this case, animals that act against NATURE are useless, and I have noticed that such animals in the WILD are usually killed and eaten by others. It is HUMANS who make an unnatural act POLITICAL, and therefor FAR MORE DANGEROUS to humanity and good living in the long run. A scientific prognosis is that there is a new AIDS-EBOLA type combination coming along, which is 1000 times MORE VIRULENT than the old. The prognosis of EFFECT seems to mirror the PROPHECY that 25% of the Earth's people will DIE of a "Plague" fitting this description: And in ARMY TERMS – the affected will suffer from "SELF-INFLICTED" causes or injury. (punishable in the military of most countries). Proponents of homosexuality are AIDing and abetting mass deaths and disease. One does not put his penile extension into a SEWER canal without sooner or later suffering some WEIRD DISEASE. I guess that is why the Levites and Old Leaders found it necessary to add a DEATH PENALTY to their national laws. Look up the African Ebola effect… and the SOLUTION: So many died and none seen to SURVIVE, including doctors and nurses involved, that the hospital set up was surrounded by barbed wire fences, and escapees were SHOT and KILLED, to PROTECT the REST OF THE UNAFFECTED PEOPLE. So, rather than PROMOTE SIN, we should be actively pressuring politicians to REVERSE THE TREND that WILL destroy our nations!

    • Sum Ting Wong

      I like how perverts get so upset and troll these waters so they can espouse their deviant expressions. Deep in their minds is a turbid and violent hatred for christians, because true christians recognize the satanic practices of their perversity. Their idol of destruction is homosexuality, a lust for same sex and many perverse practices. Homosexuality is an exceptionally promiscuous practice, it has nothing at all to do with love…even of a love between two men or two women. It is purely lust in action and that is only one part of its diabolical nature. It is anti-family, even though some homosexual couples attempt to "create a family." Gays are entirely self-serving in their interests, and they condemn christians, and the Bible, because a true christian knows the danger and perversity which a gay lifestyle does to society and spirituality.

    • keyboardshark

      Chris says: "Homosexuality is normal in many animal species."

      Many animal species also kill each other, so should we emulate that behavior as well?

      I question your claim that 'homosexuality is normal in many animal species' to begin with. Another poster to this web site, who shall remain nameless, posted this same argument in the past and offered some examples to supposedly prove his case. Turns out, it wasn't really homosexuality, but rather asexual reproduction (reproduction by the female without assistance from the male). Quite a difference I'd say.

  • BRENDAN

    yes GOD WILL JUDGE SODOMITES-LIKE HE JUDGED THEM AT SODOM AND GHOMORAH——–THEY WERE DESTROYED AND PUT TO DEATH.— DONT PLAY GAMES WITH YOUR ETERNITY.-WE HAVE ENOUGH SUFFERING FROM THIS ACT OF SIN–MISBEHAVIOR-MENTAL DISORDER–DECADENCE–PERVERSION-ECT- SUCH AS AIDS,SVERE DEPRESSION, EPADEMIC SUCISIDE RATE—5 TO 1 OVER HETROSEXUALS.—BILLIONS OF DOLLARS OS COST AND SUFFERING TO THE TAXPAYER BECOUSE OF MEDICAL COST DUE TO AIDS,ANNAL CANCER–USA WAKE UP NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • Gordon

    You are not "judging" anyone when you condemn so called "same sex marriage". God has clearly revealed His will and opinion of it in scripture. You are simply coming into agreement with the Word of God, because He condemns it!

  • Winston

    What all Americans, not just Christians, should be alert to is how the government works. Throughout the Bible the works of Satan are typically done through "subtle" lies and deception. Once the government starts marginalizing Biblical and moral teachings by forcing aberrant sexual deviate lifestyles on the whole population, by laws and in schools, it will be so subtle for it to also enter the church. And when people just cave in and start "accepting" the immoral for moral it makes you guilty (as in Romans chapter one) of equivilent to committing the sexual deviation and sin yourselves. Fight back!

    • Kalev

      Excellent point Winston, thanks for taking the time to post that.

    • msjallen

      Yes, Winston, these things have been creeping up on us for a long time and We the People let it slide because so many have rejected His Word and now a days anything goes. Talk about subtle; that is Satan's game plan and those without Bible Doctrine get sucked in by the thousands.

      • Winston

        Exactly, and when liberal evangelicals continue flocking to and joining up with the likes of Joel Osteen, Rick Warren, Bill Hybels, Richard Foster, and other apostate pastors, they will continue abandoning any concern for Biblical teaching and will have become "man-followers" which the Bible warns against in these end times of the Church ages. When believers … and even many ordained pastors which have attended "theological colleges" … do NOT pray for the gifts of the Holy Spirit there'll continue to be the eroding of Christianity in America. Prepare to take your "church" gatherings underground because it will happen sooner than you think as the government will continue persecuting Biblical Christians.

        • msjallen

          I agree with most of your comment except that I believe that believers are given their spiritual gift or gifts at the time of salvation and we don't ask for them.
          I Cor 12:11 But one and the same Spirit works all these things, distributing to each one individually just as He wills.
          Eph 4:11 And He gave some as apostles, and some as prophets, and some as evangelists, and some as pastors and teachers,

  • http://www.kidon.com/media-link MalikTous

    My own beliefs are that sex between consenting adults and civil unions involving consenting adults are no threat to anyone except greedy pseudo-religious pyramid scheme scum counting on rteproduction to keep them in congregants who'll cough up money to support the hoax. I'd kick the government out of the whole question with the exception of issuing minor tax benefits to common households and survivourship benefits to consenting adults who have obtained a civil union (which would be automatic with but independent of church weddings and available separately). Churches would individually define weddings; Unitarians and other open faiths would wed any consenting adults while those faiths who only support heterosexual relations would only marry opposite gender consenting adults, and all civil unions would be honoured legally as equivalent. That way everyone has access to their own faith and we can quit this stupid conflict! Homophobia and bigotry suck!

    • Robert De Leon

      Malik:
      Yo talk about homophobia. What about heterophobia? Sexual acts between same sex gender it's not only against NATURAL and MORAL Laws, it's a stupid thing.
      Robert.

    • Davidmgus

      I agree MalikTous…Since the call of this open letter is in defense of marriage, perhaps it should be directed towards the prevention of divorce. Wouldn't the same rationale apply? But then it is certainly easier to point to the gay community rather than clean up the mess one finds in the church with all of it's divorces. By some measures evangelicals have a divorce rate as high or higher than other religious (or non-religious) groups. It is typical of so many in the church to try to control the behavior of others. Life is far too short to get lost in attempting to deprive the happiness of anyone whose consensual behavior with another has no real bearing on themselves.

    • msjallen

      Take into consideraton…Reversal of roles: homosexuals and lesbians – It drags down the society and is degeneracy and has an effect on society. Loss of authority orientation.
      Homosexuality & lesbianism, and other sex deviates are in conflict with what God designed for marriage.
      Legitimate sex is what God intended only in marriage and illegitimate sex is from the sinful nature of man’s will.
      Normal sexual sins like sex before marriage (fornication) and adultery after marriage that destroys marriage
      Abnormal sexual sins are homosexuality, lesbianism, incest, bestiality, etc.
      Criminal sexual sins like rape, pederasty, pimping, pandering, prostitution, sexual mutilation are distortions of sex.
      People need to know God's viewpoint and not man's viewpoint.

    • Wendell

      Malik Tous, you are quite right about homosexuals sucking among other things–Get a life!

  • RAM

    "The wages of sin is death", from the fall from grace of Adam and Eve, man has fallen into sin. It has grown over the years, to the point where it has been rationalized, even by many Christians. Homosexuality is a sin, but that is a half truth, that man uses to create a divide. An agenda that satan uses to confuse many Christians. The Bible tells us that God's only covenant of a sexual relationship is between a man and a woman, under the bonds of Holy matrimony.

    Ephesians 5:21-32: 21 "and be subject to one another in the fear of Christ. 22 Wives, be subject to your own husbands, as to the Lord. 23 For the husband is the head of the wife, as Christ also is the head of the church, He Himself being the Savior of the body. 24 But as the church is subject to Christ, so also the wives ought to be to their husbands in everything. 25 Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ also loved the church and gave Himself up for her; 26 that He might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word, 27 that He might present to Himself the church in all her glory, having no spot or wrinkle or any such thing; but that she should be holy and blameless. 28 So husbands ought also to love their own wives as their own bodies. He who loves his own wife loves himself; 29 for no one ever hated his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, just as Christ also does the church, 30 because we are members of His body. 31 For this cause a man shall leave his father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife; and the two shall become one flesh. 32 This mystery is great; but I am speaking with reference to Christ and the church. 33 Nevertheless let each individual among you also love his own wife even as himself; and let the wife see to it that she respect her husband."

    Now, compromise, or half truth's, are not a part of God's Kingdom, nor the Bible. The Bible is the instruction book for His children, but it will be the half truth that man will use to take His Word out of content and context.

    The WHOLE TRUTH stands in marriage, between and man and woman under God, being the only sinless act of sex. To that end Homosexuality is just a part of the WHOLE TRUTH. If we are to be accurate the flesh of premarital sex, masterbation or any other sexual deed, is NOT of God. But, you cannot stop there. Even our hearts, our very thoughts fall in sexual sin and are NOT of God. Now, in this WHOLE TRUTH, I am calling myself out, being no better than those of homosexuality.

    Now, as a Christian, it is not my job to judge any of this, outside the children of God, but the Bible tells us that Gods children will keep each other in line with God, and call out each others sins, who claim to be Christian. In this matter, this would be like a married man sitting with his wife in church with their two children, and a young woman sits down next to him and kisses him. The man rises and states that this is his mistress, and adultery is okay with Christians. As a Christian if I did not call out that sin, presented as a fellow Christian, than I am abiding it. One of the hardest things to do, as a Christian, is to call out immorality in a friends life, and it will be uncomfortable in doing so. The thing we, as Christians, have to remember is we are to live in this world, full of immorality, justification and ridicule of us, but we are not of it. Compromise, is NOT a part of God's Kingdom, or the Bible. Man will compromise Gods Word, by taking it out of content and context…but that's not God. That's us. Nothing that we have is really ours, and in the end all that we will have between God and us, will be our hearts and either standing with God, or we will have 'pitched our tent' just as Lot did with half truth compromising that puts God in a box, of the values of man, or completely ignored.

    To this WHOLE TRUTH, Paul said it best, even to those claiming to be Christians. ACTS 17: 24-31

    24 “The God who made the world and everything in it is the Lord of heaven and earth and does not live in temples built by human hands. 25 And he is not served by human hands, as if he needed anything. Rather, he himself gives everyone life and breath and everything else. 26 From one man he made all the nations, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and he marked out their appointed times in history and the boundaries of their lands. 27 God did this so that they would seek him and perhaps reach out for him and find him, though he is not far from any one of us. 28 ‘For in him we live and move and have our being.’ As some of your own poets have said, ‘We are his offspring.’

    29 “Therefore since we are God’s offspring, we should not think that the divine being is like gold or silver or stone—an image made by human design and skill. 30 In the past God overlooked such ignorance, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent. 31 For he has set a day when he will judge the world with justice by the man he has appointed. He has given proof of this to everyone by raising him from the dead.”

    God Bless.

    • Ron Valiquette

      Long post but right on.. Amen brother!

    • Laur

      You have really written so much truth. Thank you. It makes a person think for sure about their life.

  • Ron Valiquette

    It is ther homosexual protesting the Chriatian against homosexual marriage who is the bigot against morality!

    • http://rationalresponses.blogspot.com/ Jeff Dixon

      Divorce—The grave sin of divorce condemns those who divorce and remarry (Matthew 5:32) and those who divorce in the civil sense (except by grave dispensation). Hence divorce between two baptized Christians is a mortal sin. Yet, many Christians get divorced.

      Barna report: Variation in divorce rates among Christian faith groups:

      Denomination (in order of decreasing divorce rate)
      % who have been divorced

      Non-denominational **34%
      Baptists29%
      Mainline Protestants25%
      Mormons24%
      Catholics21%
      Lutherans21%
      ** Barna uses the term "non-denominational" to refer to Evangelical Christian congregations that are not affiliated with a specific denomination. The vast majority are fundamentalist in their theological beliefs. More info.

      So, Christians rail against homosexuality because it is a sin according to their belief system. Yet divorce is also a sin according to their belief system. Yet, they are willing to get divorced in large numbers. Why the hypocrisy?

      • RAM

        The way many Christians treat divorced people you would think that divorce is the unpardonable sin. It is not! On the other extreme there are those who don't think that divorce is a sin at all. Our society's view of divorce changes, but God's doesn't and the Bible gives us God's view on divorce. Divorce has reached epidemic proportions in our society.

        There seems to be a lot of confusion among believers over what the Bible teaches about divorce. It's obvious that many churches have lowered the standard, and any believer who wants to get a divorce is often encouraged to do so. Unscriptural divorce is one of the great evils of our time. Many churches are as lax in their divorce laws as were the ancient Pharisees who allowed divorce for "every cause."

        While most have lowered God's standard, some have raised it. Some people look at the divorce rate and say, "We have to stop divorce." So, in order to stop divorce they come up with a doctrine that says, "No divorce for anybody, for any reason, and absolutely no re-marriage for anyone, anytime, who has been divorced." They look at the problem in our society and say, "In order to stop the problem, let's take the Bible's standard and raise it." Now, that may sound good and that would sure make it simple but there is just one problem with it, it's not biblical. And therefore just as wrong as the lax view because it is not what God states as the standard either. what we must understand is what is God's standard, what do the Scriptures teach. The first thing that I want you to understand is that God hates divorce.
        (Malachi 2:14-16). Does God view divorce differently in the New Testament? No!…but I think this will answer your question. The Pharisees wanted to bring Jesus a test He couldn't pass, they wanted to discredit and destroy Him. Divorce was a flaming issue throughout Palestine. This issue is known in Jewish history as the "Hillel-Shammai" dispute. Hillel and Shammai were two famous Rabbis who were heads of rabbinical schools in Jerusalem. They lived about a generation before Christ.

        • RAM

          Hillel taught that a Jew could divorce his wife for any cause whatsoever. Shammai held that divorce was lawful only for the cause of fornication.

          Rabbi Shammai didn't have a great following because his view wasn't popular with the people. Rabbi Hillel's view was very popular. He taught that you could divorce your wife for burning the dinner, for putting too much salt on the food, for taking her hair down, for speaking to men, or for saying something unkind about her mother-in-law. You could even divorce her if you found someone prettier. In other words, you could divorce your wife for any reason at all. This was the popular view and the view that the Pharisees taught. The Pharisees were hoping to have Jesus publicly pronounce the reigning monarch of the area as a fornicating adulterer, and thus put his life in jeopardy.
          (Matthew 19:4)" And He answered and said to them, "Have you not read that He who made them at the beginning 'made them male and female,'

          Jesus' answer was beyond their customs, beyond their Rabbis, and beyond their traditions all the way back to what God said in the very beginning in Genesis 1:27 " So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them.", Genesis 2:24 "Therefore a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and they shall become one flesh."
          But to sum this all up, when Jesus said, "Have you not read" He was pointing out their utter ignorance, "You have read the law haven't you?" Jesus quotes from Genesis and gives four reasons why it is not lawful to divorce for any cause.

          • RAM

            1. God created One man for one woman (Matthew 19:4). God created Adam and Eve. That's it! He didn't create any spares, no Ethel and no Earnest, (just in case it doesn't work, try somebody else). There was nobody else, no spares, options or alternatives. The Divine intention in the very beginning was one man for one woman for a lifetime. He didn't make provision for polygamy, divorce or homosexuality by creating spares. For Adam and Eve divorce was not an option. When God created one man for one woman, He set that standard in motion for all of human history. Just because spares came along as time went on, it didn't change God's intention.

            2. Marriage is a strong bond. Matthew 19:5 "and said, 'For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh'?" The word "joined" means: "To have a bond that cannot be broken, being glued or stuck." So God doesn't allow divorce because He created one man for one woman, because of the strong bond of an indissoluble union with no option.

            3. Marriage make the two one flesh. Matthew 19:6 "So then, they are no longer two but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let not man separate." You can't divide one. In marriage two people become one flesh.

            4. Marriage is a work of God. Matthew 19:6 "So then, they are no longer two but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let not man separate." The word "separate" is the Greek word chorizo, which means: "to divorce." What God puts together, don't divorce. Marriage is a God ordained institution. Marriage is one man for one woman, it is a strong bond, it is two becoming one flesh, and God is the one who made marriage. So, if we divorce, we are destroying what God made and placing ourselves in a very serious position. The Word of God is very clear on this.

            Exodus 20:14 (NKJV) "You shall not commit adultery." This is saying, "Never violate marriage." The consequence for adultery in the Old Testament was death. (NO JOKE!) Leviticus 20:10 'The man who commits adultery with another man's wife, he who commits adultery with his neighbor's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress, shall surely be put to death." We see here that adultery could end a marriage. Why adultery? Because according to God's law it resulted in death and there is little question that death ended a marriage. God says, "One man for one woman, strong bond, one flesh, work of God, no divorce." And if you commit adultery, you loose your life. There really was no provision for divorce. In the case of adultery, however, execution would free the innocent party to remarry.

            Matthew 19:7-9 "They said to Him, "Why then did Moses command to give a certificate of divorce, and to put her away?" 8 He said to them, "Moses, because of the hardness of your hearts, permitted you to divorce your wives, but from the beginning it was not so." In verses 7 and 8, Jesus says the divorce bill was a provision given because of their sinfulness, "but from the beginning it was not so." Then in verse 9, He gives the biblical standard; "And I say to you, whoever divorces his wife, except for sexual immorality, and marries another, commits adultery; and whoever marries her who is divorced commits adultery." Divorce was not permitted "except" in the case of fornication. This is the one and only ground for two believers getting divorced. God Bless.

  • Ron Valiquette

    It is the homosexual protesting the Christian against homosexual marriage who is the bigot against morality!

  • TryAgainBubba

    I was hoping this article would finally explain why religious leaders believe marriage equality threatends liberty. Still no answer, unless you believe your "liberty" requires the freedom to discriminate against those who don't believe what you do. If that's the benchmark, it would appear that only a theocracy would suit their purposes.

  • really!

    Calling someone "Homophobic" is just name calling. It is nothing more than a cheap retreating attack without substance. Someone who believes that what the Bible says is to be taken literally (specifically regarding homosexual acts in this case) could just as legitimately call those with the opposing view "Bibliophobes" or "Christophobes" or some other made up name. What good does that do in resolving the argument? Those in favor of legalizing same sex "Marriage" simply don't care what the Bible says and want to do what they want to do and will go to great lengths to push their agenda, regardless of the adverse affects that it will certainly have on society. I might have some respect for them if they would at least have the courage to admit the truth about their agenda and stop hiding behind cheap attacks and false arguments to win hearts and minds of the weak minded.

    • msjallen

      Thanks, "really", I like those names for anti-Biblitist and anti-Christians. I will be using them.

    • Robert Koomans

      Homophobic, is a word meaning FEAR OF HOMOSEXUALS / ITY. Christians are only labeled this BY RADICALS under influence of SATAN! – DARE TO SAY IT! God has been accused of being homophobic, but God does not fear ANYTHING! – he may hate the SIN, yet loves His Creation enough to send His Son to us to SHOW US A BETTER WAY. God even allows a "gay" to REPENT and turn AWAY from sin (repentance is an ACTIVE sign of responding to forgiveness). Yet Our Creator has IN THE PAST allowed men to DIE without saving them – WHY? – Well, Yeshua (Jesus) compared being saved with NOAH and MOSES and others. What was the reason for that? – Well, NOAH LISTENED to God, and DID AS COMMANDED, despite the ridicule from others, and we KNOW who were SAVED! The others CHOSE TO IGNORE and continue in SIN until they DROWNED! – there IS a lesson in this. MOSES listened to God, despite the ridicule of some, and despite having to give orders that were "Strange" to us. We know about those who walked away with MOSES. But there were MANY who disbelieved, and stayed on in Egypt: They were not RESCUED from slavery and beatings. The JEWS who LISTENED to Yeshua's warnings about the then coming DESTRUCTION OF JERUSALEM, and took the advice to FLEE to ALL the corners of the Earth (and as advised: hoping they were not pregnant or with a breast-fed baby or on THE SABBATH) were SAVED from EXTINCTION by Roman armies. descendants now live in all countries including Japan, China, New Guinea etc. But Western Jews FORGOT why they were saved and BY WHOM they owe their salvation to. Christians ALSO have FORGOTTEN their GOD and Yeshua! – They no longer try to OBEY the Commandments given to ADAM (first of mankind) and MOSES. (Gen 2 and Ex 20). Many churches ACTUALLY MAKE EXCUSES (against all biblical evidence) of why they follow a man's DAY, instead of GOD's DAY, and are KEEPING the "Mark of the Beast" instead of keeping the SIGN (or mark) of God WITH THEM. – And is it any wonder that "Christians" feel not quite so blessed by God? – John wrote about those issues of OBEYING GOD, or not. he said that God does not LISTEN to prayers of those who don't want to OBEY. Of course, we must remember that churches are more BUSINESS than INSTRUCTION FROM GOD. They pander to the HOLY $ rather than BEND TO GOD'S WAY!

  • buck

    Gay marriage is a threat to civilization itself worldwide because EVERYTHING in EVERY culture and religion is based on opposite sex marriage and nothing else can really be acceptable without an eventual devolution of civilization as it has developed . This is one of the very facts that tend to prove progressives and the changes they want in society is as insane as they are in their thinking , if indeed what they do can be called thinking .

    • Robert Koomans

      You said in a few words what took me 2 PAGES to say…. Really GOOD work, Buck!

  • Nancy Sternberg

    The Bible either directly or indirectly is against same sex marriage throughout both the Old and New Testaments. From the time Adam awoke and there was a help meet for him and that help meet was a woman whose name was Eve, by the way. In Genesis 19 the behavior of the homosexual population of Sodom is described very graphically, not accepting the word "no" from Lot. Sodomites were taken out throughout the Old Testament again and again. In the New Testament Jesus died for all sinners including homosexuals and things were very different. We as Christians are to be a witness to them but the sad thing is that it is probably considered hate speech thanks to those liberals. At the White Throne Judgement it will be too late for them to turn back.

    • Robert Koomans

      Very good reply Nancy: Remember that GOD HAS RULES TOO! – And some of those RULE include WHO we must HONOUR, RESPECT and OBEY, in Gen: 2! – the major OBEDIENCE and Honor law is the 4th. But only less than 5% of churches TEACH this, or OBEY it. So many OTHERS make EXCUSES (against ALL biblical evidence) why they don't have to OBEY that "ONE" in particular, (which automatically by default causes us to "BREAK ALL OTHERS" as Yeshua (Jesus' real Hebrew name) taught us for understanding… That LAW is a BINDING SIGN OR MARK on His People who OBEY Him. The OTHER DAY as used by many (Die Solaris – Sunday – 1st day) is actually MADE BY MAN, prophecy showed it happening, and did from about 231AD after an EDICT (prophecies usually go from edict to edict, such as the destruction of Jerusalem by Romans, to the renewal of Israel by the UN in 1948)… And is known as a MARK on the followers. And therefore if we honor the Man's DAY, instead of God's DAY, we pay allegiance to a MAN, not God. We are warned in REVELATIONS to "come out of Babylon" or confusion with what Yeshua taught, v what we have been told for 2000 years almost! – (that also was a part of prophecy – being BLIND and DEAF to The Truth of God.) BUT: We have the RIGHT to CHOOSE our destiny. Salvation or DEATH! – IF we want salvation, we must TRUST IN WHAT YESHUA SAID, more than what man SAYS! BUT WE MUST ACT SOON!

  • Laur

    Just the thought of same sex marriage makes a person sick. It is a sad thing for sure. With people like Ellen and Rosie, it is so sad they just didn't keep it to themselves. WHo respects them really?

    • Bro.Menard

      The whole lot of Pedophiles and Homosexuals known to Hollywood and the maim stream media as "so called" role model, that is the crowd that respects them, supports them and promotes them. They are as far from Godliness as is mentally, physically and/or spiritually possible. Any way one wants to describe it. They are the product and image of the anti christ. And no I would never write that with a capital letter!

  • msjallen

    Our society has been coddled into believing the Public Lie. Homosexuality and Lesbianism is an attack of human freedom. (Like the law that was passed to protect them from hate crimes and not given to any other member of our society) It is a sin. It is curable. If we permit this sin, our society has a cancer that will destroy it.

    • Bro.Menard

      It is not a disease, therefore it is not curable. It is a chosen lifestyle that goes against the very nature of God and natural affections known as husband (Man) to wife (Woman), parent (Guardian/Instructor) to children and sibling to sibling, etc. That is why the Bible never describes it as curable except one way, death! That no longer means one needs to shed blood or take a life but under the new covenant of Jesus Christ only by Repentance which calls for turning away from the unclean lifestyle!!!

      • msjallen

        Bro. Menard, I stand corrected except to say that any sin can be overcome through the understanding and application of the Word of God. Homosexuality is a sin like any other sin and God forgives all sins when we confess them (1 John 1:9) since they were judged on the cross. If you mean by repentance that one changes their mind about their sin and confess it to God the Father then I agree.

  • Wendell

    The whole idea of having sex with another man, since I AM A Man makes me viscerally ill! Those who do this kind of thing are perverts. They are abnormal, because most people are not emotinally and mentally screwed up, they know the difference between a man and a woman. The word abnormal means, "those who do things which does not confirm to what most people do!" Look, if there are men and/or women out there who want to be an affront to God, that is your problem, not a God-given right!

  • http://twitter.com/TutionBeliever @TutionBeliever

    Jesus said “Those With Out Sin Cast The First Stone!” As Christians We Must Pray for the sinner to stop the sin and sin no more, Rebuke the sin and unconditionally Love mankind as JESUS DID! JUDGEMENT Is MINE Says The LORD!

    • RAM

      "And early in the morning He came again into the Temple, and all the people came unto Him; and He sat down, and taught them. And the scribes and Pharisees brought unto Him a woman taken in adultery; and when they had set her in the midst, They say unto Him, Master, this woman was taken in adultery, in the very act. Now Moses in the Law commanded us, that such should be stoned: but what sayest Thou?" "This they said, tempting Him, that they might have to accuse Him." "But Jesus stooped down, and with His finger wrote on the ground, as though He heard them not. So when they continued asking Him, He lifted up Himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her. And again He stooped down, and wrote on the ground." "And they which heard it, being convicted by their own conscience, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even unto the last: and Jesus was left alone, and the woman standing in the midst." "When Jesus had lifted up Himself, and saw none but the woman, He said unto her, Woman, where are those thine accusers? Hath no man condemned thee?" "She said, No man, Lord."
      "And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more." (John 8:2-11 KJV)

      This passage is taken out of content and context all the time. Jesus was calling out these men's participation in this sin. The meaning of these words called out their very soul into their sin, and knowing they participated were convicted on their own guilt. The fact is, the Bible shows God calls out for 'Righteous Judgement', that meaning those that claim to be Christians. Jesus points out the biggest threats comes from within the 'church', and take a good look at the parables for that proof. Those, outside Gods Kingdom, are Gods responsibility, and He states that judgement is His, so on that front you are correct. God Bless.

  • Bro.Menard

    Problematic here because there is no reason to cast a stone. The Rock has Already Judged All Humanity. That Word of God is Judging each and every one of us continually. Without Obedience there is only Condemnation! Faith is Perfected thru Obedience Of, By and Through the Word of God, not by repeating a prayer nor justifying Abomination as just something else that needs to be prayed about. If God's Workmen on Earth do not Stand Firm Against Evil, Evil Will Prevail. That was never God's plan when He Purified unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works. God proclaimed "As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent." and we as God's workmen are commanded to Rebuke Sharply even the Promoter of Evil !!!

  • James

    that why god made Adam and Eve. a man and a woman to replenish the earth he did not say Adam and Steve.