NY Times Unfair to Christians... Again - ZIONICA.com

NY Times Unfair to Christians… Again

The New York Times published an advertisement carrying the headline "It's Time To Quit The Catholic Church" on March 9. Placed by the Wisconsin-based Freedom From Religion Foundation, the ad was a scathing attack on the Catholic church and encouraged liberal and nominal Catholics to abandon their faith.

"We invite you to free yourself from incense-fogged ritual, from ideas uttered long ago by ignorant men, from blind obedience to an illusory religious authority," the FFRF ad urged.

Four days after the FFRF ad appeared in The Times, two organizations — The American Freedom Defense Initiative and Stop Islamization Of America — sought to place an ad that mimicked the FFRF ad in almost every way. The proposed ad, however, encouraged moderate Muslims to exit Islam.

"It's Time To Quit Islam" the headline in the proposed ad read. It asked, "Will it be religious freedom, freedom of speech, or back to the Dark Ages? Do you choose women and their rights, or imams and their wrongs? Whose side are you on?"

The ad, though, has yet to see the light of day in The Times. Pamela Geller, a blogger and executive director of Stop Islamization of America, indicated the Times told her the situation in the Middle East is such that it would not be appropriate to run the ad at this time. However, it might consider running the ad at another time.

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Bobseeks

Actually it is time for all to leave the roman heresy and embrace the GOD of the Bible rather than than man-made god of the popes and roman tradition. The atheists can see the first part, but they are too ignorat to see the second. They are lost in man-made myths and fables just like the followers of the popes.
- Gedi
  
  Bobseeks, there are two biases at stake: NYT's religious bias (Christianity vs. Islam), and your denominational bias. You allow your denominational bias cloud your view of the larger issue of NYT's regilious bias.
  - Bobseeks
    
    I don't care about religious bias when that bias is directed at heretics and neither does GOD. Freedom to slander GOD (as the roman church church does) is not a Scriptural concept.
    - Gedi
      
      Those who speak so assuredly about matters they know or should know they do not fully understand adeserve pity no scorn. I do not scorn you.
    - lurl
      
      How could you care about religious bias after all, you are too interested in inserting your own bias.
      You certainly do bow down to an impotent god who can't stand a bit of criticism.
      The RC church has been around for ages and will be here for a few more then it will go just as all religions are leaving the scene. Their inanity and greed are driving them out of any relativity in todays world.
      The sooner these religions, invented by human kind, are gone the better off we all will be.
  - Myrtlelinder
    
    Forget denominations for perfection. they are made up by and with humans who are all sinners, most of us trying to do GOD'S will but fail regularly. If we will forget our bias on denominations and focus our Bibles and study along with attendance of our favorite church, to learn the truth we will come much nearer to live according to GOD'S will. We need both, church attendance and bible study.
    
    Psalm 100
    
    1. Make a joyful noise unto ;the LORD,all ye lands.
    2. Serve the LORD with gladness: come before HIS presence with singing.
    3. Know ye that the LORD HE is GOD; it is HE that hant mad us, and not we ourselves; we are HIS people, and the sheep of HIS pasture.
    4.Enter into HIS gates with thanksgiving, and into HIS courts with praise: be thankful unto HIM and bless HIS name.
    5. For the LORD is good: HIS mercy is everlasting; and HIS truth endureth to all geerations
- dntmkmecomoverther
  
  …and you evidently are to ignorant to spell 'ignorant'. The 'roman tradition' would be the Christianity that came from the time of Constantine. You may want to do some history in the NT church of that time before you badmouth it. All of our current forms of Christianity arose from that time and from the OT/NT followers of Jesus. It's only in the latter times that some have become apostates. I'm no Catholic however, I don't deny their right to observe their religion(although I would love to engage them so that they might see why praying to Mary rather than Jesus is a real slap in Jesus' face.)
  - Bobseeks
    
    You seem confused. Are you positing the right of blasphemers to blaspheme by worshipping a fertility goddess in disguise (Mary)? Would you care to point to the Scripture that allows such freedom (don't waste your time, there is no such Scripture)? Also, the roman tradition is the tradition of the roman catholic church which is made up of the lies of the popes. I did take Church History and aced it. You seem to be more interested in mis-spelling than heresy and you make common cause with the anti-Christs of the papacy. I am sure that Jesus is just thrilled to death that you want to "engage" those who have turned His mother into a false goddess and who have "slapped" Him in the face and that you support their right to do so. By the way, all papists are apostates and have been for centuries.
    - Scarface
      
      Bobseeks; you are waaaaay of base son with your rant about the Blessed Virgin Mary.
      - Bobseeks
        
        Mary is seen as the co-mediator with Christ and, in some cases, the co-redeemer and fools pray to her; so, where am I off base? The roman church is a church that has praticed syncretism for centuries – the "saints" and mary are nothing more than substitutes for pagan gods set up to appeal to the pagans and draw them into this faux, heretic pseudo-church. Also, mary is no longer a virgin, Jesus had siblings. Do you want to stick with that lie also?
      - Scarface
        
        My God says to avoid evil at all costs…so I’ll just chalk this up as a brush with evil and break off.
      - Bobseeks
        
        You are not fooling anyone. You have no answer that wouldn't be another papist lie.
      - http://rationalresponses.blogspot.com/ Jeff Dixon
        
        And you, Bobbiesocks, only offer posts of delusional nonsense.
    - dntmkmecomoverther
      
      …and your attitude and response is so Christian and appropriate. Bob, you have much to learn about evangelism and truth. Attitudes like yours are what fuel atheist’s disdain for Christians. (although I am no atheist by far)
      - Bobseeks
        
        Evangelism by spreading lies is evangelism by satan. The roman church spreads lies about Jesus, mary, and a host of other things, therefore the roman church is evangelizing for satan. Telling the truth is Christian, what you are doing is anti-Christian. Also, all true Christians are disdained by atheists because atheists hate the truth just as you apparently do. There is only one true doctrine, one way to salvation and the roman church has perverted the former and, therefore, hides the latter.
      - dntmkmecomoverther
        
        ..and there’s that gracious attitude again…. Any day you want to have a sincere doctrinal conversation, bring it on. Get a Bible and a Book of Concord because you’re gonna need both. I’m quite well read in each of them; you should be as well. And just so you know, I am a Christian, and I subscribe the the Holy Scriptures as the inerant Word of God; and I accept the doctrines of the Book of Concord…just so you know.
      - Bobseeks
        
        I save grace for those who are not working with satan and who do not show a lack of grace by nit-picking spelling. By the way, what does a Lutheran book have to do with the roman heresy? And the book of concord is useless because it is extra-scriptural and, therefore, subject to error. Now I can see where you are coming from – you follow the traditions of men rather than the teachings of Scripture, therefore denying sola Scriptura and showing your lack of faith that the Bible is all we need.
      - dntmkmecomoverther
        
        Bob, you are just one more Biblical illiterate with a big mouth. You don’t seem to have been able to get a grasp of the debate that raged in the Reformation, and how well the Lutheran’s waged the debate, and so, you truly do not know how to engage in a theological discussion; as all you have to stand on in your opinion of what Scritpture is saying as a whole. I would rather stand on the shoulders of those reformers who were much wiser and learned than myself, the giants of Christianity (even if I don’t accept all that they say) than to summarily dismiss their intellect. As an example, I don’t buy into Calvinism, but he sure was a brilliant fellow. Zwingli and others whom I don’t follow, still brought much to the debate. From your posts, I must summize that Christian doctrines (teachings) mean very little to you. If that’s true, then how would you debate the task of discipleship as Jesus commanded it in Matthew 28:18-20?Oh and on your statement of ‘saving grace for those who are not working with Satan’, just how do you fly that by what Jesus said in passing judgment on those whom you do not know and have never met? You can take that up with Jesus when you meet Him I guess…as Jesus said that His grace was sufficient for all who believed in Him.
      - Bobseeks
        
        As I said earlier, those who quote the "judge not" are generally liars, apostates, and atheists trying to deflect the truth as you are obviously doing now by dragging the reformers (whom I respect, but don't worship) into an argument about the roman heresy. Your mis-direction proves that you are deceitful in your nature. And you are right in that I do not accept Christian teachings outside of the Bible unless they agree with Scripture. I find it strange that you would feel otherwise since the reformers believed in sola Scriptura and fought and died to expose the roman heresy with its extra-Scriptural teachings. You keep stumbling over your lies and contradictory positions. You also bring in the Great commision to further confuse the issue like some nasty squid sqirting his nasty ink to hide from a predator. I name you "sir squid" the defender of apostates and heresies.
      - dntmkmecomoverther
        
        You’re a sick man Bob; I pray for you.
      - Bobseeks
        
        Don't bother sir squid. You pray to satan, not GOD.
      - dntmkmecomoverther
        
        Frankly, It appears you would not recognize either if they stood in front of you right now. Your attitude as a so called follower is quite abhorant.
      - Bobseeks
        
        To you and only because I keep deflating your obviously inflated view of your theological "knowledge". As I have said before, I crave the contempt of liars, atheists, and apostates, i.e., people like you.
      - dntmkmecomoverther
        
        Bob, you can climb your ashterah pole as high as you like, but you’re still just a fallible human whom Christ died for. Nothing more; nothing less.
      - Bobseeks
        
        Never claimed to be anything else, Sir Squid. By the way, it is you who are climbing the ashterah pole by making common cause with the roman idolaters. Like the roman priests, you might find it pleasurable to sit on it.
      - dntmkmecomoverther
        
        You do though; and you are evidently blind to that fact. You demean anyone and everyone who doesn’t see scripture ‘your way’. Do you actually think or believe that you are the first one of all mankind to ‘get it right’ ? How arrogant you are…Christ warned of men like you. Gal. 5:15
      - Bobseeks
        
        There is only one way to see Scripture and that is GOD's way. There is no room for opinions and men's traditions. I strive to understand the Bible and test every thing I am told by men against GOD's Word. You, on the other hand, stand up for those who lie and pervert Scripture. Just look up "false teachers" and "deny me" to see Christ's warnings about "men" like you.
      - dntmkmecomoverther
        
        ‘..One way’…and you of all men, consider yourself above error. Amazing. And improbable. Remove the plank from thy own eye before judging the speck in mine.You are incorrect when you say there is only ‘one way’ to ‘see’ scripture. The unbeliever before they are baptized or have heard the Gospel, would hear the phrase ‘died for your sins’ completely differently than you and I. The Gospel can be heard as an afront to those who have yet to let it work within them. Would you leave no room for the unbeliever to have the Holy Spirit work within them? Or would you simply call them infidels; heretics? Faith works in many different ways within the lives of people.A different sermon can come from the exact verse of Scripture; how do you account for that fact if the pastor is not hearing or seeing something more each time they read that verse?I must say, that the faith you exude is not very conducive to turn minds and win souls. I suggest you learn of Christ’s attitude toward those whom he was called to save.
      - Bobseeks
        
        You are well on your way to being a "master" false teacher and deceiver. You speak with the deceptive tongue of confusion just like your master satan.
      - dntmkmecomoverther
        
        Pure Bull. You are so full of BS your eyes must be brown. I am certain of my eternity with Christ; it’s folks like you who foam at the mouth about their so called faith that have something to doubt and worry about. May God have mercy on you.
      - Bobseeks
        
        I am so afraid – another condemnation from another one of satan's servants. I don't think i will lose any sleep tonight Sir Squid the Knight of Apostasy.
      - dntmkmecomoverther
        
        Well, if I do get to hell and you are not there I will know there is a place lower. Sleep well.
    - Robert De Leon
      
      Bobseeks:
      There are two reasons why "deformers" fight against my Catholic Faith: ignorance and/or hate. If you say that you have studied the Church History then you are full of hate. You just let me know what part of the Bible you didn't understand?
      About Mary, Mother of God:
      Genesis, 3:15; St. Luke, 1:28 and 1:35; St. John, 19:26-27, Revelation, 12:1-5
      (Do you dare to say to our Dear Lord Jesus Christ: "I love you but I don't like your mother?")
      About the Papacy (St. Peter's Office):
      St. Mathew, 16:18-19; St. Luke, 22:31-32; Acts, 15:7-9
      Stop your hate. It's going directly back to you!
      Robert
      - Despeville
        
        Stop swinging emotional bludgeon of "hate, hate, hate" and start using your God given intelect Robert.
        Your evasion and manipulation is the exact copy of the tactic homosexuals use who also scream and whine about "hate, hate, hate"…Does this inconsistency and dichotomy of your position ever trouble you? Or you are that good about covering it even before yourself?
      - Linda F.
        
        There is a big difference between loving and respecting Mary the mother of Jesus, and praying to her/worshiping her. I love her and respect her, but I refuse to cross the line by praying to her and worshiping her. When I pray, I pray to God. I don't pray to Mary, in the hopes that she'll pray to God and intervene on my behalf. JESUS is my Mediator; not Mary! I trust HIM to intercede on my behalf.
      - Bobseeks
        
        I dare say that I love Jesus and have respect for the real Mary of the Bible, not the pagan abomanation of the roman heresy. Once again you reveal your lieberal nature by equating hate with truth.
      - Bobseeks
        
        There's some more mis-spelling for whats-his-name to whine about. He strains at gnats and swallows camels.
    - Gedi
      
      Bobseeks, how would you feel if one spoke so disdainfully of your ordinary mother? What godly spirit rules a man who dares to speak as you do of the Mother of our Lord Jesus Christ whom you call your Lord and Saviour, and of whom God through His Angel said "Blessed art thou amongst women?" You are not a credible defender of Christ.
      - Bobseeks
        
        Gedi: You are a liar and no Christtan – I have not spoken ill of Mary at all, I have spoken ill of the abomination that the roman church has created and called Mary. Those who defend this fertility goddess and the false teachings about her are condemned as false teachers and idolaters. Jesus will condemn those who have worshipped and prayed to her in defiance of scriptural warnings against worshipping idols and false gods.
      - Gedi
        
        Bobseeks: the words you speak shall judge you.
      - Bobseeks
        
        As will yours apostate and defender of lies.
    - lurl
      
      Cleverly I ask you madam…
      What group of religionists do you follow?
      You are a JW are you not?
      - Despeville
        
        Nope auntie Slur Witch… Was that your exposure? Indeed it was not hard to go from there to plain occult.
  - Linda F.
    
    Why are you criticizing Bobseeks for his accidental misspelling of the word, "ignorant," when you obviously need a few lessons in punctuation and in placing the appropriate amount of space between words?
    - dntmkmecomoverther
      
      My criticism of Bob is his incredible level of self rightiousness which Jesus condemned in the Pharisees. Bob has much to learn in his faith walk and I despise his attitude as a so called Christian when he paints such a lousy theology of Christ. My point was that Bob constantly calls others ‘ignorant’ so it was ironically being pointed out that he didn’t even spell ignorant correctly. You seem to have missed the larger point as well.
      - Bobseeks
        
        Sir Squid (see above). Let's get specific: Do you support the lie of Mary being the co-mediator/co-redeemer with Christ? Do you support the lie of her assumption into Heaven? Do you support the lie that our works must be added to GOD's grace to be saved? Do you support the lies of purgatory and the treasury of meritorious works? Do you support the lie that praying to Mary and the "saints" is ok with GOD? Do you support the lie that we must go through some sodomite, pedophile priest to get to GOD? Do you support the lie of Mary's perpetual virginity? Do you support the lie of the immaculate conception? Do you support the lie of papal infallibility? You claim to be of the reformers, and yet you speak up for the heretic church that strove to silence them through torture and murder. You are a host of contradictions Sir Squid!
      - Bobseeks
        
        I forgot: Do you support the foul lie that papal scibblings hold equal weight as Scripture?
      - dntmkmecomoverther
        
        See below….
      - Bobseeks
        
        There is no "below" that I see.
      - dntmkmecomoverther
        
        Sorry, I thought the text would come through. Here are my replies to your questions:Sir Squid (see above). Let's get specific: Do you support the lie of Mary being the co-mediator/co-redeemer with Christ? Absolutely NOT. Do you support the lie of her assumption into Heaven? Nope, she gains heaven just like any follower of Jesus. Do you support the lie that our works must be added to GOD's grace to be saved? Absolutely not (see Eph. 2:8-10) Do you support the lies of purgatory and the treasury of meritorious works? Absolutely not. Do you support the lie that praying to Mary and the "saints" is ok with GOD? Absolutely not. Do you support the lie that we must go through some sodomite, pedophile priest to get to GOD? No. I do support that there is a public ministry however. Do you support the lie of Mary's perpetual virginity? Not when scripture clearly states that Jesus had other sisters and brothers…Do you support the lie of the immaculate conception? Absolutely not; if Jesus is born of a ‘sinless’ woman, and his father is God, then who would overcome sin for us? Do you support the lie of papal infallibility? No Way! Man is fallible…period. You claim to be of the reformers, and yet you speak up for the heretic church that strove to silence them through torture and murder. No, I don’t. I simply said that the Catholics have a right to express their religion (heretical as it is) due to our 1st Amendment; it was YOU who jumped to the conclusion that I accepted their theology. You are a host of contradictions Sir Squid! You sir are one lousy example of a Christian. Once again, I will pray for you that God’s grace will allow you to be much more civil and a better example of Christ’s love shown to man.Go to comment
      - Bobseeks
        
        The 1st Ammendment is irrelevant and only an apostate liar would use that as justification for standing up for the "rights" of the heretic roman church to speak its lies. GOD condemns heresy and there is no freedom of speech for heretics in the Bible. Once again you place the traditions of men over Scripture, Sir Squid the Knight of Apostasy.
      - dntmkmecomoverther
        
        If all you can do is resort to name calling, then we are done. You have no basis other than your rhetoric; you clearly do not understand salvation by grace. You are a neanderthal in the basics of discipleship. And the 1st amendment IS relevant if you want to espouse your rhetoric; without it, our current regime would come out and shut you up; along with all the rest of us. How would you like that? Get a grip Bob.
      - Bobseeks
        
        Sir Squid: Once again you squirt your nasty ink by bringing an issue into the argument (grace) that is not part of the argument.Enough of this emotional blathering and calling the kettle black when you are the blackest of pots.Just provide me with SCRIPTURAL back up for your defense of the roman heresy's right to spread its blasphemous lies. As far as I am concerned, if freedom of speech and freedom of religion mean the right to slander and blaspheme GOD, then we can do away with them and let the true Christians come forward who are willing to speak without being granted that "right" by evil lovers of man's law such as yourself. By the way, I fully understand grace and know that it is not extended to heretics and Knights of Apostasy such as yourself, Sir Squid.
      - dntmkmecomoverther
        
        You speak from a ‘dominioin’ theology; as you asked of me, please support that with Scripture as Jesus would. And since you seem to love name calling I will now refer to you as ‘Abaddon’…a fitting name for one who besmerches the grace and mercy of Christ. Hosea 6:6.
      - Bobseeks
        
        Call me what you will, I am not of the "sensitive man" type and I crave the contempt of satan's apostles. Scripture: "Peter and the other apostles replied: “We must obey God rather than human beings!" Acts 5:29. This incident plainly illustrates that when there is a conflict between man's law and GOD's principles, GOD prevails; any other stance is satanic. Now, come back with some specious argument to "prove" your satanic beliefs.
      - dntmkmecomoverther
        
        ..then you despise Christ. That makes you one huge heretic. End of conversation Bob, you’re hopeless. I had hoped for a civil discussion but you are not capable nor willing.
      - Bobseeks
        
        Sir Squid: You are not fooling anyone, you have nothing to offer but lies, therefore you quit the fight without making any points but satan's. Good riddance Sir Squid.
      - dntmkmecomoverther
        
        ..there is no fight. The fight is oe’r the battle won…or did you miss that memo in Scripture?
      - Bobseeks
        
        Sir Squid: That is from a hymn and refers to the fight between Jesus and your master satan. Apparently, you did not get the memo because it is time for his minions to surrender.
      - dntmkmecomoverther
        
        And you are a child pretending to be a man. You are a sorry example of a Christian. God knows that and I hope you figure that out before you cause too many to stumble. Look up ‘skandalon’ in a Greek Bible Dictionary if you have one…for that is what your actions will do to other believers if they hang around your poisonous attitude too long. Heaven help any who have never heard the Gospel if they get around you. Skubalon would be the Greek that describes you to a T.
      - Bobseks
        
        Golly, more name calling from the one who "despises" name calling. Once again you shift from side to side just like our deceitful resident atheist. I guess I should expect that from another of satan's lesser minions. Sleep tight apostate, perhaps tomorrow you will wake up with a clear head, a diminished ego, vastly greater wisdom, and then repent of your blasphemy and defense of blasphemy.
      - dntmkmecomoverther
        
        No, when I was a child I thought like a child; but like Paul, I have had to deal with children like you and still do. My idea of a nightmare, would be to wake up and have to listen to someone like you. ‘Diminished ego’ indeed…you mean like yours? Your ego wouldn’t fit in a barn. Vastly greater wisdom? From the conversation presented by you that wouldn’t take any effort. And you keep goind back to a ‘defense of blasphemy’ which I have clearly not supported. So you simply want to continue bickering like a child. If you were in front of me I bet it would be a whole different conversation; as I find most who behave so obnoxiously on line are quite different in person. That must be true for you or someone would likely rearange your body parts for you. Good day Bobsucks.
      - http://rationalresponses.blogspot.com/ Jeff Dixon
        
        Bobbiesocks already admitted to being bullied in school. It is pretty easy to see why that would have occurred.
      - Despeville
        
        Jeff,
        
        How are those gonads? Still sharp?
      - http://rationalresponses.blogspot.com/ Jeff Dixon
        
        They are hanging just fine. Why are you so concerned about another mans private parts?
      - Bobseeks
        
        Now you show your vindictive, pseudo-Christian nature Sir Squid of the inflated ego and tiny wit. I post the truth to your lies and blaspheming and to thank me for trying to make you aware of your peril you mock me. Oh well, I'll just have to pray for your arrogant, vindictive, GOD-hating soul. I see that, when it suits your purpose, you join with an atheist like lurl, you truly are one sorry excuse for a man.
      - dntmkmecomoverther
        
        Ya know, I bet you were bullied as a kid and this is the only way you have to pull yourself up. What a disgrace to humanity and an insult to Christ. Go soak yourself.
      - Bobseeks
        
        Once again you join with your fellow atheists in trying (without success) to insult me. Your fruits betray your rotteness Sir Squid the blasphemer and enemy of GOD.
      - lurl
        
        Sir Bobsucks,
        Why do you have such a problem with the RC church? Do you have the same affinity for hate pf Lutherans, Episcopalians or Presbyterians?
        Why should you be so bothered by what others believe? Were you one of those many boys who had crushes on their priests and were thrown out of the church for making unwanted advances?
        Where do you get your information on Mary and the saints. Were you there to check out Mary's state of virginity or lack thereof?
        Where do you stand on the various Liturgies? How about Liturgical seasons? How about communion?
        Bobsuck try and explain your resources for your massive amounts of information on the RC church.
      - Bobseeks
        
        Did someone just expel some noxious gas from their nether regions?
      - lurl
        
        Obviously you can not respond to real questions about real subjects. You are a fraud and liar.
        The stench is emanating from your own fetid body.
  - Myrtlelinder
    
    AMEN!! PRAY TO MARY OR WORSHIPING MARY is not Biblcal. We do not even worship the disciples who all but John died for HIM and even John was persecuted the point that most men would have died from it..
    - dntmkmecomoverther
      
      Thanks Myrtle; I have taken nothing but aggravation from ‘Bobseeks’ for this post. God bless!
      - Bobseeks
        
        No, you have heard nothing but truth regarding roman blasphemy and your defense of said blasphemy Sir Squid.
- keyboardshark
  
  Maybe what this thread needs is a little humor:
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AtdRZGVgWjo
Mary

Bob is more ignorant of the Catholic than Stalin or Adolph were.
- Bobseeks
  
  Actually, half of my familiy is made up of papists and I know all about the idolatry, blasphemous myths about mary, and false teachings of the pope/anti-Christs. It is you who are ignorant of what Scripture teaches because you are blinded by the lies of roman tradition.
  - Despeville
    
    How many of them actually read the Catechism in depth? Maybe some but surely not all. From those who did how many read the Bible in depth? Still some but surely not all. Of those who remain how many read BOTH the Bible and the Catechism and ACTIVELY COMPARED them to each other? Here your group drastically narrows down if anyone one is left at all. If so of those who would be in that group how many did that active comparing and included in it PAST and HISTORIC editions of the Catechisms??? You know the answer Robert: NONE.
    
    I did not even included in this portrayal papal bulls and encyclicals…yet you all think that you know because you know…
    - Despeville
      
      I was actually responding to De Leon and not to Bob.
    - Sama
      
      It is so sad that both of you so freely run your mouths about stuff you hear from people who are not fully living their denomination. The first denomination. (Mary is the Ark of the New Covenant and is due great respect) Shows you don't do your OT/NT study. I fear you are doing more harm to your own Christianity than you are in "righting" the oldest Christian denomination. Look to your own heart/mind/soul and live by example rather than hate filled words. We KNOW that Mary is in heaven with her Son. The early Christians had NO Bible to follow, they followed the Traditions they were taught by Jesus and the Apostles. When the first Bibles were distributed, they were a bit different than what King James put out in order to cover his own marital sins.
      - Bobseeks
        
        "Mary the Ark of the New Covenant". Would you care to direct me to where that can be found in the Bible? If not, you are a condemned blasphemer.
      - Despeville
        
        @Sama
        
        " (Mary is the Ark of the New Covenant and is due great respect) Shows you don't do your OT/NT study."
        
        If that is the case can you please point us to this in the Word of God? I mean since you did the "study" you should be able to show us a clear proof for your claim. I am anxiously looking forward to learn that from you…
        
        'The early Christians had NO Bible to follow, they followed the Traditions they were taught by Jesus and the Apostles"
        
        Again do you have any proof for that? Do you also have any proof that the "traditions" mentioned in NT are the same and representative of your "traditions" from 2000 years later? I would love to see Scriptural proof for both of the claims you propagate. Please educate me in my error…
        
        "'When the first Bibles were distributed, they were a bit different than what King James put out in order to cover his own marital sins."
        
        really? Well I have news for you, Christian Faith is not, I repeat IS NOT depended on any particluar translation and the "first Bibles" were not "distributed"… The first ones printed actually cost a great deal of money. If you are referring to the manuscripts there were actually circulating and not being "distributed" that was done with Qu'ran and Islam with witch you have so much in common according to point 841 from Roman Catechism:
        
        "841 The Church's relationship with the Muslims. "The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind's judge on the last day."
      - bighoss
        
        You are so ignorant of your preferred cult that you do not even know that the Catholic Church rejects the notion that they are a "denomination", But I am not surprised, since I have encountered so many Catholics who are abysmally ignorant of many of the things their Papist hierarchy teaches.
- Despeville
  
  @Mary,
  
  I would be happy to discuss anything from Roman Religion with you. Starting from Roman Catechism, to Pastoral Letters, to Encyclicals, to Papal Bulls, to Canon Law, to Roman Councils and their documents and compare all of that with the Word of God. If done so with open mind there is nothing else to do but notice how many times those documents directly oppose, contradict, change, weaken and wash away the Gospel of Jesus Christ and some time directly curse it.
  
  Are you ready to this challenge or your laud but empty proclamations are it?
- robert
  
  Mary it looks as though Bobseeks to Judge others as the God of the Bible Clearly tell us not to for if we do we will be Judged in the Same Way .therefor People Be ware of what you do in thyis Life.
  - Despeville
    
    Robert,
    
    Unfortunately you are taking BOTH verses OUT of their immediate CONTEXT and even if that assertion of yours would be true (and its is not) on purely reasonable level you are judging yourself here by implying "judging of others" to Bob…
    Have you really thought through what you have believed in? It surely does not look like on any level.
  - Bobseeks
    
    Robert: Judge not is the favorite verse of liars, apostates, and atheists who try to deflect the truth. Those who use Scripture out of context are false teachers who will face judgment.
  - lurl
    
    And yet! You and your ilk are non-stop judge-mentalists. In fact you should call your religion by that name.
    - Bobseeks
      
      Again that rancid stench . . . . . I believe it is the smell of a rotting corpse or an atheist.
- lurl
  
  My dear,
  if you are referring to one of the former leaders of Germany Adolph Hitler did you not know he was a true member of the Roman Catholic Church. He was Baptised, confirmed and fully received into the life of the church. If you knew about this man you would know he was a great servant of Rome but not of the German clergy.
  Check out history.
nctar

New York Times should leave all churches alone, I haven't read anywhere that they were set up as judges. Get lost NYT! Oh wait…you're already lost!
aceituna

Freedom of Speech should permit such an ad to be run. I can see danger in some places for the ad placers, but in general in our country it should be permitted. The Islamists fear the power of a witness to Jesus as God, Lord and Savior of mankind. Politically correct papers such as NYT don't want to ruffle any feathers so they clamp down on freedom of speech. It is up to us to spread the news and publish this message.
bulldustin

The NYT is so gutless toward Islam that all they can see is The Catholic Church as they know they will not BOMB them nor Kill anyone speaking out. Its Good to slam Americans but be nice to the Mideast Goons. Its sad that its a NO GUTS so called News Paper .
http://webook.com William D'Andrea

The problem is that running that anti-Islamic add might have antagonized some very dangerous people, who are know for engaging in extreme violence. While I don't agree with the New York Times, I think that by not running the add, they were being responsible citizens, who were trying to prevent acts of extreme violence.
- Bobseeks
  
  So, in your opinion, we should cave in to the violent?
  - Judy L
    
    Right .. give in to the BULLIES and encourage them to escalate instead of letting them know we will not believe or tolerate their violent religion. I thought bullying was a zero tolerance behavior…..
- LouiseCA
  
  Then they had no business running the Catholic-bashing ad. They are the biggest hypocrites around. They are literally SHOUTING the fact that they know they can bash Catholics (and other Christians) because there will be no consequences to them. Christians will not fight back. But they're scared of Islam, so they've gone into dhimmitude. The make me nauseated.
bighoss

It is sad when the Gray Lady (New York Times for those unfamiliar with its long-used nickname) is so intimidated by the violent and unreasonable disposition of militant Islamic barbarians that it refuses advertising of this kind. If the Times is going to refuse the AFDI's advertising, then it should, at minimum, refuse ALL advertising that critiques religions. Otherwise, such groups as atheists are accorded an unfair advantage in the marketplace of ideas. Shame on the Times.
- Bobseeks
  
  The Times is infested with lieberals just like you bighoss and they support the master liar maobama just like you do. They also support all the evil of the democrat party just like you do. Who are you trying to fool here, poser?
Chris

Bring on the religious wars – "My religion is better than your religion – nannanannanna"
- Ken
  
  Because as we all know, atheist regimes have shown us the way with respect to peaceful coexistence…..just ask the neighbors of China, North Korea and the old USSR.
- Bobseeks
  
  Good morning dilbert. Do you plan to bring more disgrace on the already pathetic "profession" of engineering with your nonsense today?
- Esteban Cafe
  
  And your religion? Atheistic regimes have murdered over 100 Million people in the 20th century alone. I would not proclaim them too loudly by decrying other religions.
  
  Communism has only killed 100 Million. Let's give it another chance!
  - http://rationalresponses.blogspot.com/ Jeff Dixon
    
    Communistic countries killed over 100 million. No one has been killed in the name of Atheism, no matter how many times you incorrectly state it. Communism and Atheism are not the same thing.
    - Despeville
      
      Hahahahahah and a astonishing lack of education and petrifying irrational bias shines on again… That is the only "light" you have Dixon. Thanks to that kind of sin imposed imbecility humanity goes from one genocide to another.
    - Bobseeks
      
      Communism is the bastard child of atheism. It is the logical end of a mind perverted by unbelief.
      - http://rationalresponses.blogspot.com/ Jeff Dixon
        
        I see that you are as ignorant of political history as you are of science or world history. The Communist movement was created out of the roots of Socialism.
      - Despeville
        
        What would you quote from actual history to prove that dumbo Dixon?
      - Dave
        
        Socialism was created by athiest to control people. And in the claim it to better man.
    - Dave
      
      Oh Jeff wow your are SO far out wrong, Athiest is a faith in man and that communism was set in motion to better and to control man. Like in Russia you were persacuted to be a Christian or a Jew. In North Korea they kill hundreds a DAy for being Christian. In China you are Persacuted for being Christian and even just for have a bible you are put Into prison.
      
      So agai jeff My uneducated Blind Friend Communism is a athiest Faith and created by athiest faith, Stallin was athiest along with N.Korea dictator.
      So get your fact right!!
      AND AND Grow UP!!!!
      - Despeville
        
        I am afraid none of that will get through two inch thick cranium of Dim Ox Dixon.
        You are talking to a real kook here as it will be evidenced further by his lame rant.
- lurl
  
  How can those of us who have no religion bring on a religious war. Ho! Hum! Here it comes.
mose

STOP BUYING THE NEW YORK TIMES.See how many muslin buy it.Do it for one month and get even
- bighoss
  
  I don't know how many "muslin" buy it. I don't know how many percale buy it either!
  - Despeville
    
    Another wacko trying to patch up inferiority complex by hunting typos and errors of others.
    I would never know how many dangerous lamebrain sociopaths are there if it would not be for the internet.
    - bighoss
      
      Not really. It is just amusing to me how many semi-literate incompetents write with such rabid intensity of feeling about subject matter they can not even spell correctly.
      
      The late, great, Walt Kelly gently poked some fun at the Black Muslims back in the 60s with his fictitious "Blue Muslin" group.
      - Despeville
        
        Hoss, you not going to believe it but I was actually trying to respond to somebody else… and it went down under here. You and I disagree on some things, particularly on "all mighty free will-ism" of a fallen man but I do not think you are a wacko. In fact I actually think you are one of very few intelligent and educated people who regularly post here even though I do not care for your Obama fan-club.
      - bighoss
        
        I do believe you, since your initial reply was very out of character with the tenor of our interaction on this forum.
        No problemmo.
        
        Done any fly fishing lately? The water has warmed up around here and I have been hittin' the hungry bass pretty hard. Best effort–week before last–7 fish totaling about 18 pounds.
- lurl
  
  Muslin is wonderful. It is used in so many ways. I love it myself and tea-dye a lot of it for use in my creations….Oh! So god like it is amazing.
- LouiseCA
  
  It's a policy of mine never to spend my money on, or to consume, trash or garbage in any of its forms. Therefore, I have never purchased the NYT and very doubtfully ever will.
Ken

I say let the NYT run whatever ads they can get, it's not like they have a readership anymore.
Robert De Leon

As many people from Media, The New York Times writers are cowards. They don't dare to publish anything against Islam for they know their lives are at risk.
Another thing. I always have thought that Media is a kind of Anti-Christ, or at least it looks like to me. Therefore, I am not surprised about this ad. What can you expect from evil people? Evil.
Robert.
- Bobseeks
  
  Yes, the NYT is a kind of anti-Christ, therefore it has a lot in common with the roman heresy.
  - Despeville
    
    Indeed Bob.
- lurl
  
  What a deep thinker. Why have I not thought about the media as an anti-christ? Media=all are evil.
  Sit back and watch Howdy Doody Time I have heard it is one of your faves.
  Bet the rest of the time you get your misinformation on FOX.
  - Despeville
    
    Slur Witch,
    
    Drunk in a comatose state is a deeper thinker than you on your best day.
Alan

What do you expect from the western edition of "Pravda"?
- Despeville
  
  hahahahahahaa
  
  Here is the original: http://english.pravda.ru or http://www.pravda.ru
Pastor Jailal

I am not surprised at the NYT. The press proves itself over and over as anti-Christ. Satan will use anything and anyone to achieve his agenda – discredit the Messiah, Yeshua and shake people's faith in the Holy Bible. Islam gets a free pass because this religion serves the agenda of satan – the destruction of Christanity. It is exactly as was prophesied in the pages of the Holy Bible. Authentic believers need not fear anyone and anything. Soon this satanic culture will be crushed by the returning Messiah. Then the NYT and all other vessels of the devil will cease to exist.. Come Lord, Yeshua… come!
- Esteban Cafe
  
  Sir, people are not supposed to have "faith in the Bible"…we're supposed to have faith in Jesus Christ. The Bible tells us about Him and relates His teachings. Nor are we supposed to worship the Bible itself, but the subject thereof: Christ.
  - Bobseeks
    
    But, if we don't believe what the Bible says, we have no basis for belief in Christ.
    - http://www.facebook.com/people/Andrew-Patton/592034163 Andrew Patton
      
      Sure we do, for there is another testimony: the Church. Someone can be completely illiterate but take the Church's word for it.
- lurl
  
  Have you not heard Pester Jailal that jesus and satan are brothers? Probably twins both from the same planet.
  - keyboardshark
    
    Hmmm, no, I hadn't heard that one. Let's see some proof.
    - lurl
      
      Check it out sharky. It seems to be the sum and substance on most religions.
      - keyboardshark
        
        It "seems" to be. Wow, that's real convincing proof.
Walt

Hmmm.. Lets see in Revelations Jesus tells the 5 of the 7 churches to repent. Which church are you. Make you election sure. Test yourself? Remember the Bible also tells us to examine ourselves daily to find out if we are in the Word. Read 1 John 4 and give it a try you have nothing to lose and eternal life to gain.
Taquoshi

Newspapers in general are a dying breed. The New York Times is particularly vulnerable. So, in order to survive, they are being provocative. However, newspapers rely on ads to cover the cost. So, let's hit back.

As for the comments about the Roman Catholic Church being a cult, you can say that all you want, but then don't expect the Catholics to back you when your particular denomination is in the cross hairs – and it will be.

As for the atheists, maybe it's time they get some push back from us. Just because they don't believe doesn't give them the right to persecute those of us who do.
- lurl
  
  Sasquatch,
  Why is it the xians always go around whining and crying they are so persecuted. They seem to still be alive and ripping off hard working people daily.
  They still are controlling or try to those of us in the world of modernity and reality.
  Wake up your way of life is over so start anew and be free of your shackles.
  - Taquoshi
    
    lurl –
    
    1.) Nobody's trying to control you.
    2.) And would you kindly provide the facts around Christians "ripping off hard working people daily".
    3.) I'm not shackled, but thanks for asking.
    4.) Your attitude speaks volumes.
    
    Have a nice day.
Esteban Cafe

Yawn. Does anyone really care what the NYT's says about anything?
- bighoss
  
  Guess what? I DO!
  
  That is a start on answering your question. Only 20 million or so more to go.
  - Bobseeks
    
    No surpise there, it is all democrat lies to be read by democrat liars such as yourself.
Despeville

But when it comes to the truth there is only White or Black Hoss. Do not mix spiritual truth with politics.
Bobseeks

Bighoss the poser: It is you who can't see because you can't see the contradiction in your spurious claim to being a Christian and your support of maobama the malignant and the murderers, perverts, thieves, loafers, union gangsters,drive by shooters, and general scum of the democrat party.
e.rebus

The person mentioned with an inside to the Times, Pamela Geller, is the one people should worry about. She is a rabid zionist that should be writng about orthodox Jews stoning women rather than spreading her vile against Muslims. Geller and those like her, such as Foxman, are the problem.
JAS

This issue more than any other shows the absolute hypocrisy of the media for the simple reason they are so desperately in fear of muslims and yet somehow muster the "courage" to "take on" Christianity.
And while I do fear the stupidity quotient in America is rising, I think there are still enough rational humans paying attention as is evidenced by the declining revenues OF NYT.
But isn't that what we love about liberals, they will go down with a sinking ship. Does Air America ring a bell?
Despeville

No need although you should stop being so cheap and shell out $200 a session for some time.
It would do all of us so good.
lurl

Bobsucks can't see his Optometrist…afterall, he can not see and, I doubt he can hear and surely his speech is garbled.
lurl

Check them out…I think they have a great recipe for CROW that you would love to eat.
Jacalyn Nost

LOL, I don't know about it being communist, but I see your point. I do, however, use the cloud for my documents (like this article), but I always have local backups. With documents I write for the public, I'm obviously not concerned about security.Tavis J. Hampton recently posted..Linux and the Dual Monitor Dilemma
ceejay

WHO reads NYT anyway. It won't be long before this TOILET PAPER goes under. I won't even use it to help train my puppy.
Glen

But Bob is still right its time to turn to God and not a church or a denomination we will after all stand before God and give and account and this involves alll the saints, including the Pope.. Its is not the Chruch or the pope that saves you but Jesus Christ the only acceptable, pure and unblemished sacrifice acceptable to the Father.
Robert Wayne

The New York Times is another left wing rag. And like all left wingers they hate anybody who's white, Christian, heterosexual or anywhere to the political right of Lenin, Stalin or Mao. I wouldn't buy anything advertised in their left wing propaganda rag.
bighoss

Yes, and great book reviews.
bighoss

I have a suggestion for you. Subscribe to the Washington Times. It wll be a good source of nourishment for your bigoted,ignorant views.
http://twitter.com/lambsev11 @lambsev11

R U red E 2 C Jesus? All God's gentile faithful will have to come to Him, and I can't see this as other than coming out from among the false teachers, be they Roman Catholic, Lutheran, Presbyterian or and other denomination. We are saved by the Name and blood of Jesus and by His teaching, not the teaching of men.

2 Corinthians 6:17
Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you.
Revelation 18:4
And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.

Thank you Jesus that your chosen people are under your watchful care.
Jeremiah 12:14
Thus saith the LORD against all mine evil neighbours, that touch the inheritance which I have caused my people Israel to inherit; Behold, I will pluck them out of their land, and pluck out the house of Judah from among them.