Can Christians Vote for a Mormon?

To view the world through a Christian lens is to see a truth about life that is otherwise often papered over with happy faces and motivational slogans: The world is fallen, cracked, and flawed. Sin has deformed everything. It has made everybody a bit crazy.

It means that we never make choices between the perfect and its opposite. Every choice—whether for a spouse or a car or a pastor—is a choice for some brand of imperfection. Nowhere is this certainty more starkly revealed than in politics. The Prussian statesman Otto von Bismarck made this point with his famous saying, "Laws are like sausages: It is better not to see them being made." Politics and the processes of government are usually ugly affairs that only occasionally produce satisfying results. The start of those processes rarely closely resembles the result. Usually a voter has to choose between "hold your nose" and "hold your nose tighter." Then he or she sits back and hopes for the best.

For American Christians, it is helpful to remember this as the November presidential election approaches. They face a choice between a politically and theologically liberal Christian and a politically conservative Mormon. Those who prefer Barack Obama, the left-leaning Christian, likely solved their dilemma in the last presidential election. Millions of voters are now confronting a new moral question: "Is there anything wrong with voting for a Mormon President?"

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Ken Kirkham

Barack is not a Christian, problem solved. The choice is Muslim or Mormon, not really that difficult.
- Bret Stiles
  
  A Mormon is not a Christian. They believe in multiple Gods, and working your way to heaven
  - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
    
    Ignorant and bigoted remark. Mormon's ARE Christian; we believe that Jesus Christ is the SON of God; so did Paul and the other Apostles of the New Testament. The End. That has NOTHING whatsoever to do with whether Mitt Romney will be a superbly better president that Obama or not.
    - http://profile.yahoo.com/HFMELPJ2QU37W53K2TKL4HJQGM Ted
      
      My best friends are Mormons. I have no problem with or from them.
      - Esther
        
        Me too
    - l
      
      Mormons, as you obviously know, do believe that JC is the son of one of many gods. He is not unique in the Mormon religion, but he is in the Christian religion. Belief in him in the Christian religion, requires that the believer understand and accept that he is a "one and only" "uniquely born" son of the ONE AND ONLY God.
      That being said, I've no beef with any Mormon I've ever met. They are, on the whole, gentle, caring people, and I have many friends who are and who have married Mormons.
      I do have a beef when people claim that their beliefs and mine as a Christian are the same.
      - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
        
        And that beef can be discussed in a different forum, and I'd be happy to have it with you :) However, theological differences in no way determine that Mitt Romney would be worse than Barack Obama, who is a communist; this is contrary to Christian ideals and the ideals of our Constitution.
      - LouiseCA
        
        Exactly.
      - http://twitter.com/KennDillon Silver Haired Saint
        
        I agree. The only choice in this election is Romney & Ryan! The debate over Mormonism and Catholicism, Jehovah Witness and other organizations/churches claiming Christianity would be better in another forum. The biggest challenge would be making sure we would all be using the exact same meanings for the words we use; therein lies the challenge.
      - Bonnie Bell
        
        Jesus is the son of our Heavenly Father, not the son of multiple gods or one of many gods. He is unique to the Church of Jesus Christ (Mormon) as the head of our church, hence our name The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, he is the one we worship, we worship no other gods, I should know, I go there every week…Attend a meeting in a meeting house near you they will be most welcoming and not try to convert you but just fellowship you as a fellow believer in Christ. We must unite as Christians with Jesus as our Savior or divided we will fall .
      - canucksam
        
        Amen and Amen!
      - petroskhan
        
        I'm curious. Mormons believe that God was once a man, as we are. He then, through diligent worship, I assume, became a god. Now, that would mean that there are then at least TWO gods out there, right? And if God was once a man, then he couldn't have been the ONLY one who worshiped whoever it was from that planet, so there must be several, if hundred or thousands of others who "ascended", right? So, how many gods are there, according to Moroni?
      - Esther
        
        You are misinformed in your depiction of what Mormons believe and furthermore, your interpretation sucks. I know that Vladimir has tried to orient you in the demeanor necessary for the study of Mormonism. It is an effort on his part gone to waste. Why don't you just try to apply your same principles of interpretation to the Holy Bible, is one idea, to self-demonstrate your hypocrisy. You often take an idea and subjugate it to it's most disingenuous form once could possibly. You have that knack. Just try it on YOUR scriptures.
      - petroskhan
        
        If I am misinformed, by all means, inform me. I have asked many questions in regards to Mormon doctrine, only to be told that I need to read the Book of Mormon. When I reply that I've read most of it, the answer I get is misdirection, avoidance and obfuscation.
        
        I've presented clear cases of conflict between the Book of Mormon and the Bible, as well as failed prophecies of Joseph Smith. No concrete, direct reply to either one has been given.
        
        I have asked many Mormons if their belief is that God was once a man as we are. I've always been told that such is their doctrine. And if you care to refute that claim, I would direct you to your own "sources" of information:
        
        "The idea that the Lord our God is not a personage of tabernacle is entirely a
        mistaken notion. He was once a man. Brother Kimball quoted a saying of Joseph the
        Prophet, that he would not worship a God who had not a Father; and I do not know that he
        would if be had not a mother; the one would be as absurd as the other. If he had a Father,
        he was made in his likeness. And if he is our Father we are made after his image and
        likeness. He once possessed a body, as we now do; and our bodies are as much to us, as
        his body to him. Every iota of this organization is necessary to secure for us an
        exaltation with the Gods."
        
        – Prophet Brigham Young, True Character of God, Salt Lake Tabernacle, February 23, 1862,
        Journal of Discourses, Vol. 9, p.286
        
        I am going to tell you how God came to be God. We
        have imagined and supposed that God was God from all
        eternity. I will refute that idea, and take away
        the veil, so that you may see. … It is the first
        principle of the Gospel to know for a certainty the
        character of God and to know…that he was once a man
        like us…. (“King Follett Discourse,”
        Journal of Discourses 6:3-4, also in Teachings of
        the Prophet Joseph Smith, 345-346, and History of
        the Church, vol. 6, 305-307
        
        "What, is it possible that the Father of Heights, the Father of our spirits, could
        reduce himself and come forth like a man? Yes, he was once a man like you and I are and
        was once on an earth like this, passed through the ordeal you and I pass through. He
        had his father and his mother and he has been exalted through his faithfulness, and he is
        become Lord of all. He is the God pertaining to this earth. He is our Father. He begot our
        spirits in the spirit world. They have come forth and our earthly parents have organized
        tabernacles for our spirits and here we are today. That is the way we came.
        
        – Prophet Brigham Young, 14 July 1861, Recorded in "The Essential Brigham
        Young", p.138
        
        Now, tell me again, if you please, how am I "misinformed" in my depiction of Mormons, or their doctrine? I am not interpreting, so my interpretation isn't what "sucks", as you put it. I am quoting. If you don't like what I'm saying, fine. Just don't kill the messenger, okay? Blame Joseph Smith, or Brigham Young, or any of a plethora of other so-called "prophets" who wrote this drivel.
      - Esther
        
        You are not reading doctrine when you read every word that is said by even the President of the Church, did you know that? No, God was not once a man! That is preposterous. President Kimball was a western man, who probably said that to make you talk. Got that? He, as other presidents like Brigham Young, was/is human. They enjoyed a good joke. Did you know Petroskhan that we have tons of written materials that we hold precious because a certain good man wrote it, even though it cannot possibly be scripture. We are not like the Catholic church to think that the Pope is infallible and is Jesus on Earth, or like Calvin who was called the Pope of the Protestants. I reiterate: All writings coming from any Mormon president is not, verbatim, "scripture." We honor it for the good person we know wrote it, although any idiot can see it is contradictory to the writing held truly to be as Holy Scripture. The Mormon church is made up of a bunch of humans. In keeping with this idea , not only that Pertroskhan, do you know that even though I am a Mormon, and although my friends in the Mormon church know I have just a bare minimum of a testimony, they would not throw me out? The reason being is that we all have testimonies at different levels, matching the "progress" we have made in our understanding and/or belief and/or testimony of the scriptures. Do you know that some Mormons never get a strong testimony of the church but that is understood, (the tree glories are there for a reason,) Mormons are honest about it, and it is not a problem they are never shunned or ridiculed, because Mormons see themselves, all of us on Earth, as children of God, sent here to be tested, to see if they could follow Christ. Why do you think they put up with you? Have you ever noticed how patient Vladimir is with you? He made a covenant to follow Christ's good example. That's why. Where did you get this in your scripture study? You didn't!!! Because you don't know how to study the scriptures like Vladimir taught you, ON TOP OF THE FACT, you don't know how to liken any of the scriptures to yourself. Mormons can see that from a mile away. That's you Petroskhan. And your church: I see in your church that you MUST BELIEVE everything even if it a contradiction, even if it is depicting God as Satan sometimes. Now who has the most true church? I will answer that because you are jaded. The Mormons do.
      - petroskhan
        
        So, what you're telling me is that the "'prophets" Joseph Smith, Brigham Young and Lorenzo Snow were wrong? They claimed to speak for God, and therefore couldn't be wrong on something so fundamental, unless they were NOT speaking for Him.
        
        Were Elders Marion Romney, Eldred Smith, Joseph Robinson, George Richards, and a host of others also wrong? They all stated the same thing.
        
        And if they were wrong about something so basic as the very nature of God, on what other subjects might they be wrong? If they were wrong, why have these statements not been repudiated?
        
        And if it's a matter of "progress" and you don't believe that God was once a man, then have you progressed farther than Joseph Smith and Brigham Young and the others I've quoted? Or have you not gotten to their level yet?
        
        Again, I am just asking questions as they jump out at me. I'm not trying to criticize, ridicule, flame, or insult. I truly would like to know the answers to the questions I am posing, and have posed in the past. Thus far, I have been denied the answer to every single question from every Mormon who has addressed me on this forum.
        
        I am in turn having MY faith insulted, my study habits presumed upon and belittled, and my spiritual growth derided. Is this the sole recourse that your church has to honest inquiry from me? Why can't I get simple answers to simple questions?
      - Esther
        
        Really? You're insulted? And I have to explain to you how men sometimes have to handle ignorance? I did not start this argument. You did. And you have not moved one iota from the position you took long ago about MY religion. Now, once again you want me to expose MY religion to more of your "analysis." Well, then, what does that tell me? It tells me you want to continue the lowness of this exchange and somehow "prove" the superiority of your religion. Well, sir, I will match you to each effort you make in doing what you say I have done, until your ignorance is displaced by some reasonable, thoughtful respect for the unique, good American church of the Mormons.
      - petroskhan
        
        And so once again, you prove my point, while pretending that you've made some sort of reply.
        
        I asked a few simple questions, and not one has been answered, nor even referred to by your "response".
        
        "Now, once again you want me to expose MY religion to more of your "analysis." Well, then, what does that tell me?" Well…it SHOULD tell you that I have questions. If you're going to attempt to answer the questions, you should have answers.
        
        And what is the problem with "exposing" your religion to "analysis", anyway? Do you have something to hide? Is there something in that religion you don't want to discuss?
        
        I'll make it simple. I quoted the very founder of your church, and several of the leading figures of the Mormon faith, clearly stating that God was once a man like us; they also stated that Mormons can and will become as He is. You replied that Mormons do NOT believe this, and made some comment regarding "progress" along the faith path. So, I have these questions:
        
        1 – If God was not once a man, and Mormons do NOT believe they can/will become as He is, why is this teaching not repudiated?
        
        2 – If Joseph Smith was a prophet of God, and spoke for Him, and this fundamental idea was wrong, about what else was he mistaken?
        
        3 – If Smith got this wrong, doesn't that mean he fails the test of a prophet given to us in the Bible?
        
        4 – If it's a matter of "progress" as you stated, then are you not as far along as Smith and the others I've quoted, or have you progressed beyond them?
        
        Four simple questions. That's all.
      - Esther
        
        I said: exposing My religion to "YOUR ANALYSIS" … not an analysis. There is a difference and I don't mind pointing that out. You are the one who gets everything all so convoluted … reminds me of an old reprimand I heard once in philosophy: "confusion to the enemy." So you give me four "simple" questions that are easily answered by an honest simple investigation but you refuse time and time again to go there yourself, to seek the truth. You prefer to get my answers in stone, do you? Petroskhan, I am not put off by your attempts to confuse me, because as far as I am concerned that is your basis for your religion. I question everything, but I also like some order in my thinking and when it happens that someone is heaping upon me all kinds of false interpretations, I start getting that feeling I am being treated like an enemy, that I must give in to false thinking as though I am "the enemy." I don't give up so easily on those points… it's against my personal constitution. There is too much contradiction in you religion, I can't let it pass for truth in my life. Don't ask me to list them. Life is too short. I can only hope that you would take stock of what I am trying to tell you. I have given your Christianity an honest try after being born and bred in it. You must commit the same as I did to find the truth.
      - petroskhan
        
        Oh, my goodness, this is more difficult than giving an annoyed tiger a root canal…
        
        First off, you keep referring to my religion. Do you even know anything about that topic? Do you have any idea what my "religion" is? The honest answer should be "No", but since you, like every Mormon I've talked to, seem to be allergic to answering questions, I'm sure that question will go unanswered as well. "There is too much contradiction in you religion…" You don't even know what my beliefs are, how can you even make that statement? And what does it contradict?
        
        What is it with you Mormons and actually ANSWERING QUESTIONS? Is your belief system so convoluted and mysterious that you are incapable of even answering a question regarding it? Not ONCE has one of you actually provided an answer to a question. Are you that embarrassed by it that you don't want any information leak out about it? No? Then what is it?
        
        And what sort of hogwash reply is this? "…I am not put off by your attempts to confuse me…" I've asked you to answer some SIMPLE questions. How is that an attempt to confuse you? I'M CONFUSED, and asking YOU to "un-confuse" me. There are things about YOUR religion that I don't understand, and I am asking for answers.
        
        "You are the one who gets everything all so convoluted …" Untrue in the extreme. I have tried very, VERY hard to keep this conversation simple. I've asked simple questions, and asked for answers. All I've gotten from every one of you is misdirection, changes in topic, and obfuscation.
        
        Let's look at this objectively for minute, okay? I've cited Mormon sources, quoted your founder and his successors, and other prominent figures within the Mormon organization. I've asked questions directly based on what I've cited. Each and every Mormon has refused to answer the questions, and instead questioned my faith, my religious study habits, etc. Everything but actually answer a question. Now, looked at objectively, who's the one making things "convoluted"? The one asking the questions, or the ones refusing to answer them, and replying with personal attacks and rhetoric?
        
        I just want information. That's all. I'm not going to some anti-Mormon website, I'm not lashing out in the dark here…I am going straight to a believer, and asking for information. I sort of thought that's what you were supposed to do, right, provide information to those seeking it? I know that's what I do; when someone asks me a question regarding my faith, or the Bible, I take the time to go over it, show him some verses, discuss it. I've had productive talks with atheists on the subject of the Bible, and gotten more direct answers than I'm getting from practicing Mormons. Why do you suppose that is?
        
        So, I will ask you just ONE question. Let's see if you, or any other Mormon, can answer this ONE QUESTION.
        
        All of those I have quoted thus far (Joseph Smith, Brigham Young, et al) state that God was once a man like us, and ascended to His god-hood. You disagree with that, as you've stated. On what do you base your disagreement with the founder of your very religion on the subject of the nature of God Himself?
        
        I await your reply.
      - http://www.facebook.com/dorothy.m.wood Mary Wood
        
        You want it simple Petroskhan. Perhaps you should listen to Myrtle and give up! BUT, that is essentially what you have done by your obfuscation of Vladimer's many advisories. It is crystal clear to me what the first step to understanding all your questions. You have the nerve to ask some Mormon girl you don't know from Adam to give you wisdom, where clearly the script James 1:5 states you must ask of God. How long have you avoided following that advice from the Master Himself while you prattle along hoping we will shoot ourselves in the foot, to make your day. Think again. We have followed the advice of James 1:5 because we don't want to be as those who are described in James 1:6.7. Vlad is right on the problem, Petroskhan.
      - petroskhan
        
        Wrong on all counts. And quoting the same verse over and over to me doesn't make any answers to my questions magically appear. Asking God for wisdom doesn't mean blindly accepting what humans tell you, either.
        
        And as I've told the other Smith worshipers on this board, I have asked God for wisdom. That's why I have questions. The two sort of go hand in hand, you know?
      - Esther
        
        That was a login error Petros. lol. Hasn't that ever happened to you. Or has being a mutant really took hold. Before you answer … note … that's a joke… where did you get that neat button btw?
      - petroskhan
        
        A friend gave me that button about 20 years ago. I love its slightly rebellious message, and its humor.
      - Esther
        
        it's neat
      - Esther
        
        You want it simple Petroskhan. Perhaps you should listen to Myrtle and give up! BUT, that is essentially what you have done by your obfuscation of Vladimer's many advisories. It is crystal clear to me what the first step to understanding all your questions. You have the nerve to ask some Mormon girl you don't know from Adam to give you wisdom, where clearly the script James 1:5 states you must ask of God. How long have you avoided following that advice from the Master Himself while you prattle along hoping we will shoot ourselves in the foot, to make your day. Think again. We have followed the advice of James 1:5 because we don't want to be as those who are described in James 1:6.7. Vlad is right on the problem, Petroskhan.
      - petroskhan
        
        Okay, I tried to be patient. I tried to be nice. I'm done with that. You're all a pack of liars, afraid to answer a few simple questions regarding your own doctrine.
        
        I started out slightly curious as to some possible contradictions between Mormonism and Christianity. I sought some answers to those questions from people I thought should have answers. I admittedly came on strong, to compel a more sincere response. Yet not one of you could find the good graces or decency to even answer one question. Not one single question has been answered. NOT ONE.
        
        I started out wanting to give it a shot, to see if those questions had concrete answers, something that would make it all make sense. But no, not one of you could be bothered to actually ANSWER A QUESTION.
        
        You, each of you, had multiple chances to do what any NORMAL Christian would do, which is to provide information. Since you can't even do that, you are forcing me to rely on the information I already have.
        
        Ergo, my opinion has changed. I started out thinking that maybe there was something I wasn't getting. Now it's clear. My understanding isn't flawed, it's YOU, and that sorry excuse for a religion you have.
        
        Each of you has tried to quote James 1:5 to me:
        "5 But if any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask from Elohim, who gives to all freely and with grace, and it will be given to him."
        
        That's great, thanks for directing me to that verse. I already knew that one, but thanks. So, since you love that verse so much, tell me this: How do you know that I haven't asked God for wisdom? Did it ever cross your minds that I HAVE done that, and do it every day, and that's why I have questions? Or are you so arrogant that you think "wisdom" equates to "Mormonism"? A wise man has questions, a fool accepts whatever he's told.
        
        You're all so quick to judge my faith, and prattle on about how much wiser and more in touch with some great cosmic truth you are, yet you know nothing about me, and can't even find the courage to answer a few simple questions regarding your own religion? Would the answers so humiliate you that you can't have them known? Is your own religion so embarrassing to you that you can't even discuss it?
        
        The part that really gets me? You're so blinded by your own arrogance and refusal to supply any information whatsoever that you don't even realize that your attitude destroys any chance of actually convincing someone that you're right.
        
        Now, I'm sure that you're going to have some sort of holier-than-thou response, something to make you feel better or superior, or whatever helps you sleep at night. But guess what? I don't care.
        
        I always thought that Mormons were just a bit quirky, maybe a bit off-base, but basically good, honest Christians, decent people with a different viewpoint. Thanks to the three of you here on this board, Esther, Vlad and Mary, I know better. You're nothing but a bunch of deceitful, secretive liars, hell-bent on hiding the truth of your Satanic cult from any sort of exposure.
        
        Thanks for clearing that up for me.
      - Esther
        
        QED as I said, quote: petroskhan is petulant : Yes .. easily annoyed and complaining… . fretful or irritable. You are fretful to the max Petros, and we have been so patient. Actually I thought of the word because it was almost poetic next to your name, but you do complain a lot, when you expect me to give you wisdom when you should ask of God… etc
      - petroskhan
        
        That's right, you cleared everything up very nicely.
        
        Go on acting superior, but just be aware, anyone following this exchange is going to seriously wonder why not one of you answered a single question.
        
        With an aversion to answers like that, maybe you should all vote for Obama.
      - Esther
        
        I think you have to ask God for wisdom, not me! What's superior about that. You act like God doesn't exist! You are childish. I will vote for the Mitt Romney who is a Mormon, who seems "wishy-washy" to "Christians," and I won't have to "hold my nose" as "Christians" have said in this forum… and you are about to see REAL faith in action but you will never see him taking credit, but he will be the most accountable person you have ever seen in that office ever in the past or in the future, and it is not because you supported him. You can rest assured he DOES abide by James 1:5 every moment of his life as all Mormons do, as Joseph Smith did with every fibre of his being. We don't ask each other what to do. We follow James 1:5. No, I don't think you do. I think you use the bible in nefarious ways to insult people and be superior yourself.
      - /.murphy
        
        Please stop abusing people for exercising their right as Americans to believe whatever they wish. No one can prove anything about any deity–including you–so go in peace, but still go. Many people believe that certain organized religions give their members a false sanctimony; I think that is the crux of the questions surrounding Romney's faith, and you have nearly perfectly demonstrated the sanctimony whereof I speak. You are like a puppy chasing its tail.
      - Esther
        
        LOL. Muphy you have got to be kidding. I have no desire to force anyone to believe anything other then "whatever they wish"! If you are referring to Petroskhan's argument with me, take note: He wants me to tell him all about my religion. I tell him to find out for himself!!!! I even requested a priest from my religion, Vladimir, who comments in this forum quite frequently, to instruct him. How is that forcing anyone to believe my religion? You must be the one forcing me. And, you have no right to do so, but I don't expect you to recognize perhaps it is you who are the petty tyrant with the false "sanctimony." How much of the interchange between Petroskhan and I have you read? Also, maybe you wife is chasing her tail. I don't do pet tricks. Thanks for the comment. It makes me realize the reality of the lack of reason in this forum is more rampant than I previously thought.
      - petroskhan
        
        I'm not asking you for wisdom. I was asking you to explain some principles of your faith.
        
        Either you can, or you can't. You've all shown very clearly you can't.
        
        So go on prattling about "wisdom" and Joseph Smith. You've shown me what your so-called faith is worth.
      - Esther
        
        Instructions on how to find out the meaning of the true Church of Jesus Christ:
        Internalize the following:
        
        James 1:5… do what it says do.
        
        Follow up with Moroni 10:4
        
        Go from there. The wisdom you gain, if you deserve it. from God, after reading from James 1:5 will carry you far in your quest for answers. No one can answer you except the Holy spirit if you are worthy. That's all I want to tell you.
      - petroskhan
        
        Been there, done that.
        
        Moroni 10:4
        4 And when ye shall receive these things, I would exhort you
        that ye would ask God, the Eternal Father, in the name of Christ,
        if these things are not true; and if ye shall ask with a sincere
        heart, with real intent, having faith in Christ, he will manifest
        the truth of it unto you, by the power of the Holy Ghost.
        
        Doesn't help. There is too much in your doctrine that raises questions. Since you all refuse to answer them, the only conclusion possible is that you are hiding something.
        
        I've prayed, read, etc. Now I have questions. Your refusal to answer them doesn't prove you're right; it proves that you have something to hide.
      - Esther
        
        Then you haven't pondered the scripture or you are truly so jaded the Holy spirit will not entertain your questions. I think you will have to put everything aside except the idea that you sincerely want answers in your heart in order for the Holy spirit to be with you, so you can know the truth of what you seek. And the next time you claim you have done everything you need to do to find the answer, and it is all mine or Vlad's or Mary's fault, I am going to tell you you might as well join Jeff in his atheism because you don't believe there is a Holy Spirit, the Third Being. I don't know how plain I (or we) have to be without exposing ourselves to severe and treacherous criticism from you and the others. Do you understand my concern?
      - petroskhan
        
        You know what's really getting to me about this whole discussion? What's at the root of the problem? I know you're on the edge of your seat, so I'll tell you.
        
        Each and every Mormon who's taken part in this discussion has basically stated the same thing, over and over. In essence: "If you don't accept Mormonism, then you're a bad person." "You're not receiving the Holy Spirit." "You haven't prayed for guidance."
        
        It's got to be something about ME, right? It can't be something about YOU.
        
        You offer no answers to questions regarding your stance on simple, basic issues, and just toss back unfounded assumptions regarding my relationship with God, as though you're all the sole guardians of the gate to contact with Him. I don't know if any one of you is aware of it, but you're displaying an astonishing degree of arrogance here. "Accept what we say, without question. If you can't, then God hasn't spoken to you" is the message you're sending.
        
        Well, guess what? I know for a fact that God does guide me, and a mind with questions needs answers to those questions. Not rhetoric, not avoidance and certainly not baseless assumptions of superiority.
        
        Think about it for a minute, would you? I quoted YOUR sources, and asked simple questions. Have I thus far receive ONE answer to ANY of them?
      - Esther
        
        Petroskhan, I don't know the people who have told you these things. But I know how I came to understand the BofM. I came to it from having been badly deceived by the Catholic church. About seven hours ago, from the timeI am writinf this message 09/06/12 Thursday! That's about 2:30 this morning. I told you how I understand the BofM!!! It is the best I can do.
      - petroskhan
        
        "I don't know the people who have told you these things."
        
        Really? You're one of them, Esther. "…you might as well join Jeff in his atheism because you don't believe there is a Holy Spirit…" Those words familiar?
        
        And I'm still not receiving a single answer to a single question, am I?
      - Esther
        
        You received everything you asked for… your
        welt·an·schau·ung/ˈveltˌänˌSHouəNG/
        Noun:A particular philosophy or view of life; the worldview of an individual or group.
        
        prohibits your understanding that you have what you need. End of story.
      - petroskhan
        
        That's a ridiculous lie, and you know it. Not one question has been answered. If you want to even come close to proving your contention that I've received everything I've asked for, prove it. Name a single question I've asked that's been answered. Every Mormon on this board has refused to answer every question I've asked. And THAT, Esther, is the "end of story."
        
        But don't fret about it. I'm done. My initial point, or purpose, was to get some information about some points of doctrine, to compare, discuss, and explore some facets of a faith which made me curious. As the questions went unanswered, and the accusations against me mounted, my purpose changed. I went from being curious about your faith, to wondering if any one of you possessed the honesty to actually answer a question without hurling disparaging comments at me regarding MY faith.
        
        As I stated before, my you have all succeeded admirably in changing my decades-old opinion of Mormons, in just a few days. I had, for the longest time, felt that the Mormons were a bit different, but still honest, forthright, etc. Now I know better, and I thank all of you for the education. A more deceitful, devious, evasive group of liars I've NEVER encountered.
        
        "You've received everything you've asked for", my foot. Show me a single question regarding Mormon doctrine that any of you has answered. ONE.
        
        I asked – If God was once a man, according to Smith et al, then shouldn't there then be MANY gods, since he couldn't have been the only one who "ascended"? No answer given.
        
        I asked – If God was once a man, then who did He worship? Wouldn't THAT being be above Him, and more powerful? No answer.
        
        I asked – If God was NOT once a man, then why is this doctrine, espoused by your founder and his successors, not repudiated in Mormon doctrine? No answer given.
        
        I asked – If Joseph Smith was wrong about this, doesn't that mean he fails the Biblical test of a prophet? No answer given.
        
        I asked – If Smith was wrong about something as fundamental as this, what other mistakes did he make? Doesn't it make other things suspect, then? No answer given.
        
        I asked – If believing that God was/wasn't once a man is a matter of "progress" in faith, and you disagree with Smith et al, does that mean that you are further along this path of "progress" than he was, or will you come to that belief later? No answer given.
        
        Now, tell me again…what answers that I've asked for have I been given?
      - Esther
        
        You ask me to deny the core of my being. Not nice Petros. Call it what you will. I think it is time for you to reconnect with Vlad.
      - petroskhan
        
        Answering simple questions about your faith forces you to "deny the core of your being"?
      - Esther
        
        We have a failure to communicate. Think anything you like as Christians do.
      - Vladimir
        
        Esther, I am afraid petroskhan has hardened his heart and is not ready to receive further truth and knowledge. Best to let Father prepare him. At this point in his life, he is only after the approval of his kind. He believes what fits his narrow understanding and relishes to display his knowledge gleaned second hand.
        
        Some day he may become humble and teachable. When that day comes he will be eligible to receive knowledge and wisdom first hand from God. I firmly believe that when he does, he will not return to the wisdom of men that he so enjoys now. As a dog returneth to his vomit, so a fool returneth to his folly.
      - Esther
        
        Vladimir: I love the Mormon people and our perfectly summarized articles of faith.
      - Esther
        
        you want to know about Mormons:
        
        first premise of being a mormon:
        if you lack wisdom, ask of God. If He answers, you will know how to proceed, if not keep trying b/c you are not doing something right
        
        second premise:
        from 10:4. This is how you read the BofM. It is the only way to know for yourself. NO ONE can convince you, not Joseph Smith, not Brigham Young, not Mitt Romney, not President Kimble, not Vlad, NO ONE! iT IS only by your prayer and your effort, will YOU and YOU ALONE know the meaning and know the truth. Other people can only encourage you along the way.
        (Stop reading all what others say is the meaning, you cannot know anything through their eyes! You have to find out on your own with the guidance of the Holy Spirit)
        
        etc, etc, premises…
        
        being a Mormon is a step wise process of knowing more, progressing in ever increasing knowledge and understanding which never ends
      - Pastor Dwayne
        
        What happened in your life when you were Born Again
      - Esther
        
        I hesitate to think you could appreciate any thing I have done. Sorry, Pastor Dwayne, I don't trust you.
      - Evermyrtle
        
        You cannot out argue a Mormon, just forget about this one.
      - petroskhan
        
        Well, I don't know…I'm pretty persistent.
        
        After all, all I want is a few answers to simple questions. If they can't provide them, maybe others need to know that, too.
      - Evermyrtle
        
        You might want answers so you better go somewhere for them, these people don't answer questions, just ask them.They will beat around the bush a little and call you names. They know you already have th goods about Mormonism
      - Esther
        
        Petroskhan is petulant, is he not, Myrtle?
      - petroskhan
        
        Definition of PETULANT
        1: insolent or rude in speech or behavior
        2: characterized by temporary or capricious ill humor
        
        You sure that's the word you want to use? If so, I'd like to see some proof I've been rude, or shown "ill humor" at any point.
        
        I would say a better word is "persistent", or "inquisitive".
      - Esther
        
        also:
        childish, testy, pettish, peevish
      - dionesius3
        
        UNIQUE??? GOOD???
        HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA
        That is truely funny!!!
        The only thing unique and good about morons is that it takes very little intelligence to see through the boys theology it is based on.
      - Esther
        
        Your intelligence is misguided, Mr. Dionesius.
      - dionesius3
        
        Whatch it Ester!!!
        you said "No, God was not once a man! That is preposterous. President Kimball was a western man, who probably said that to make you talk. Got that? "
        I am reporting you to your stake president and you will face disciplinary action for your blasphemy against gods prophets on earth!!!
        You know this is just another example LYING moron. EVERY time they open their mouth to defend their faith they have to lie.
        Because you can't recret" truth to the "outsiders".
        Heavenly Daddy might get upset with you and not let you go to temple next time…
        Go holy underwear, it stinks, just like your doctrine does.
      - sohail khan
        
        petroskhan are you sure about Obama's faith. His school record in Indonesia showed that he is a muslim and his early school friends told in an interview that he used to go to the mosque for prayer with them when he was living in Indonesia. Do you know what the muslim faith is? if you dont know, let me tell you that the muslim or the Islamic faith was created to destroy the basic foundation of the Christian theology which is that Jesus died for our sins. So Obama is doing everyting to please and pander to the muslims, morevoer he did not defend the marriage between a man and women which was is constitutional duty as the president of USA and instead supports and promotes the same sex marriage which is not supported by bible at all.
      - petroskhan
        
        Umm…
        
        Not sure what that has to do with this topic, but okay, I'll answer it. :D
        
        I'm fairly certain that BO is a muslim, actually. He speaks fluent arabic, quotes the koran (refers to it as "the holy koran" every time), belittles the Bible, bows to every arab leader, etc.
        
        I also agree with your statement regarding the nature and purpose of the islamic religion, if it can be called one.
      - sohail khan
        
        The topic indirectely asks aobut a choice between two persons that is why I have made it clear what should be the response of the christians between these two persons without going into the theological differences. Do you support same sex marriage or can any christian support same sex marriage? or are can any Christian be comfortable with a person who likes to belittle the Bible?
      - petroskhan
        
        I hear you. I agree 100%. In the choice between a muslim (staunchly opposed to America) or a Mormon (quirky religion, but likely a patriot), I'll take the Mormon every time.
      - Evermyrtle
        
        I agree with your comments. I believe, also that anyone who claims to be a Christian and will only accept a part of the WORD OF GOD, throwing the rest out, can do much more damage to believers, new, young believers than a anti-GOD person can. They teach, they preach excelent sermons and have people believing they are really right with GOD. They are responsible if the young believer believe that only given parts are reliable. This is a terrible sin!! This is something that some Mormons believe. I do not know if it is something they teach as a whole
      - Vladimir
        
        Evermyrtle, I am a Mormon and I do not throw out any part of God's word, including the Bible. You have been misled. We believe all that God has revealed, all that He does now reveal, and we believe that He will yet reveal many great and important things pertaining to the Kingdom of God. It is you who have yet to discover that God is not muzzled. He speaks to His children continually.
      - Evermyrtle
        
        There are some Mormons that throw out the "Sermon On The Mount. I am happy to hear that you do not. I guess the Mormons are like others denominations in some ways. like this one. Personally I do not know ant Christian that would throw out the Sermon On the Mount.
        
        ALL Christian accepts JESUS CHRIST AS THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GO."
      - Bar-Eliam
        
        I don't know who the son of gooo is but you and your buddy Vlad sound like a couple of really dedicated scientologists? Are you clear yet?
      - Esther
        
        Are you from the Obama camp?
      - Evermyrtle
        
        We are dedicated Christians and will remain so and will dwell in the KINGDOM OF GOD after we leave this earth. You must be a Christian, accept JESUS CHRIST as your SAVIOR to do that. to do that!
      - Bighoss
        
        God is not muzzled, but He is also not the author of confusion, which explains wht the chaotic, nonsensical things in the Mormon pseudoscriptures are not from God.
      - Ruth
        
        Amen Bighoss ! It is soooo obvious that so many of the Mormons who comment on this site ARE confused about what their own doctrine is and What their Book of Mormon says ! Satan is the author of confusion, And if they were TRULY serving the LIVING GOD they would NOT be confused, and continually be trying to mislead people to this nonsensical, as you said…pseudoscriptures which Are Not from the LIVING GOD !
      - Vladimir
        
        Petroskhan, you are not interested in knowing the truth. If you were, you would have read the Book of Mormon and followed the direction given to you in James 1:5. You haven't and you won't because you are not interest in knowing the truth. Do you see yourself in James 1:6-8?
      - petroskhan
        
        I have followed that verse, as you well know. That's why I have questions.
        
        And I know the truth, thanks to the unyielding misdirection and obfuscation of every Mormon on this board.
        
        The simple truth is that you're a bunch of liars, following Satan, and I'm sick of your nonsense. I have given far more leeway than anyone should need, and not one of you has the guts to even answer ONE question.
        
        That's some great religion you've got there, Vlad. Tell me, is lying a required course, or is it an elective?
        
        Now, you're going to come back with some sort of response about how I'm being rude, or not being a good Christian, or some such nonsense. In anticipation of that, let me state this. Each one of you has had multiple opportunities to answer many questions I've raised, to provide me with some simple information on your own faith. You decided that you couldn't be bothered to provide any of the most basic and simple answers to some very basic questions. You decided it would be better to insult me, my faith etc.
        
        So, here we are. You're all liars, hiding something from people who seek the truth from you. I'm done.
      - Esther
        
        That would be right to say you are being rude. You actually think that we have to fall in line with your wishes? We take James 1:5 seriously. Why don't you?
      - petroskhan
        
        "Fall in line with my wishes"?? Really? That's what you call answering a few simple questions about your faith? Wow, you must really take yourself seriously. LOL Talk about arrogance!
        
        And help me out here, if you don't mind. Here's James 1:5:
        "5 But if any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask from Elohim, who gives to all freely and with grace, and it will be given to him."
        
        Could you show me where, in that verse you all keep tossing at me, it says to not ask questions of people? Can you show me where in that verse it says to never question Mormons? Can you show me where it says to just accept anyones claims without asking him to explain anything?
      - Pastor Dwayne
        
        an other testament of Jesus, Gal 1:8-9 another gospel that angels bring , The big question. which God are you asking wisdom from. It is not Jehovah God. Mormons are just like Catholics , their church is the true church , therefore , you can't tell them anything .or in the case of Mormonism, they say there founding fathers were just joking about some of the comments they were making, when nailed about mormon teaching…
      - Esther
        
        Pastor Dwayne "Mormons are just like Catholics… " not at al. What is your church? Let's make some comparisons.
      - Vladimir
        
        That's quite a statement you made, petroskhan, about Mormons, "You're all liars, hiding something from people who seek the truth from you."
        
        You have previously admitted that the wisdom of men, including yours and mine is flawed. Remember that admission? You have also agreed with me that the wisdom of God is perfect. I showed you in the Bible that God will give you wisdom and how you can obtain it. Yet you continue to ask for answers to your questions from us on this blog.
        
        Why would you continue to ask for answers from flawed people when you could have the perfect wisdom of God? Are you too lazy to read the Book of Mormon? Are not interested in discovering what God knows? Are you afraid of the answer? Do you not believe the Bible is honest when it says, "If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given."
        
        Just a big hint, petroskhan; GOD IS A BETTER SOURCE OF WISDOM THAN THE INTERNET but only if you are seeking truth. Once God revealed to me that the Book of Mormon was
        true all of my other questions were answered one by one. Many of them
        are the ones you are asking now.
        
        I gave you the key to unlock the truth about the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, James 1:5. But rather than inserting it into the lock and trying it, you keep the key in your pocket and walk about sowing seeds of doubt about His Church.
        
        Do you really want an answer, or do you just want to ask questions? And why do you persist? These are THE QUESTIONS you need to ask and you need to ask them of yourself.
      - petroskhan
        
        Again with James 1:5? Dude, seriously, stop equating wisdom with Mormonism.
        
        And you know something? (Well, you should, I've said it enough times) I have prayed about this, and your Book is WRONG. It contradicts the Bible, and your faith is founded on the lies of a charlatan, a false prophet.
        
        You can tell me that God personally whispered in your ear all you like. I don't believe it, your book is a pack of lies, and not one of you has the courage or the honesty to openly discuss your faith.
        
        I've shown, beyond any doubt, that you all refuse to answer the most basic questions about your founder and the cult that he started. Dissembling, lying, insulting, etc. are the only replies I've gotten.
        
        God is a better source of wisdom than the internet, true. And my dog would be a better source of honest, open discussion than any of you has been. At least he won't tell me that I might as well be an atheist, since I have questions regarding the Mormon faith, right?
      - Esther
        
        Now I know I should have avoided conversing with you. And writing you now is not a request for further conversation.
        
        Petroskhan said "stop equating wisdom with Mormonism." Really Petroskhan?
        
        You are doing exactly what I thought you would do and I have been warned you would do. You are a pathetic.
      - petroskhan
        
        "Keep praying to your master Satan, Petroskhan." LOL
        
        Let's see…I am the one following the Bible. I'm the one putting everything I read, hear and see to the tests given by the Bible. I'm the one asking you to substantiate your claims with simple answers to simple questions.
        
        You're the one following someone who claimed to be a prophet, yet fails every Biblical test of a prophet. You're the one insulting my faith. You're the one refusing to provide truthful, direct answers to direct questions. You're the one revering a book that is riddled with errors, contradictions, and falsehoods.
        
        Who's serving Satan here? Who's the one turning against God? Look in the mirror, sister.
        
        Your "prophet" himself admitted that he had "visions" that didn't come from God. Your "prophet" made claims that can't be backed up. Your so-called "holy" book is in opposition to the truths of the Bible in far too many ways to list.
        
        And you attempting to belittle my faith reminds me of the time a chihuahua charged at my English Mastiff. Amusing, misguided, annoying, but ultimately harmless and meaningless.
        
        I would suggest that you take a good long look at that satanic phony all of you worship, and ask yourself some of the questions I've asked you. When you find you can't answer them, maybe then you'll climb down from your ivory tower and start serving God, instead of Joseph Smith. When you make that trip, you'll find me down there, on my knees, serving the true God of this earth. Not that lying phony none of you has the temerity to question.
        
        A pathetic lot of blind sheep, following a load of non-Biblical non-sense, and too afraid of questions to even consider that the answers might be worth knowing.
        
        I would say "Get lost", but you already are. Get found, sister. Get found.
        
        I'm a little annoyed at the snotty attitude I've gotten from all of you Mormons on this board, but I still sincerely apologize for the harsh tone I may have employed in some of these messages. If you scroll back, you'll see I started out polite, but I tend to get frustrated when people refuse to answer simple questions, and that's what happened here. That's no excuse, though, for not being civil. I am afraid I may have crossed the line a time or two, and therefore the apology.
        
        That said, let's just drop this whole thing. Not one of you is going to answer my questions, that's clear. My prayers will be with you all.
      - Bar-Eliam
        
        You can not get blood from a stone neither can you ever get a straight answer from a Joe Smith follower. How can they have an anwer since they have never asked the real
      - petroskhan
        
        They're pretty bad. I couldn't get even one of them to answer a single question I had regarding their faith. Talk about evasive…
      - Esther
        
        Esther • a few seconds ago • parent
        −
        Bar-Eliam: You describe yourself to Petroskhan,Bar-Eliam=listra: You make bed-fellows, no?… So there you have it petroskhan, exactly what you wanted … your side of the Mormon story told by a creep from the Obama camp. Good job Petroskhan, traitor.
      - petroskhan
        
        You're funny!
        
        Umm…one question. I know, you don't answer them, but I have to ask…"traitor"…to whom/what?
      - Esther
        
        you are too dense to follow the conversation, obviously
      - Esther
        
        You describe yourself to Petroskhan,Bar-Eliam=listra: You make bed-fellows, no?… So there you have it petroskhan, exactly what you wanted … your side of the Mormon story told by a creep from the Obama camp. Good job Petroskhan, traitor.
      - Vladimir
        
        I'll give you a straight answer, Bar-Eliam. Based on what you write, you don't have a clue. Is that straight enough for you? Do some honest research and get back to me with something factual instead of the usual anti-Mormon dribble, if you can.
      - petroskhan
        
        And just so we're clear…I don't think you're pathetic. Just wrong.
      - Esther
        
        I am wrong to have trusted you. You are pathetic.
      - Bar-Eliam
        
        Strange…the odd turning on the odder! Or perhaps that is fodder.
      - Esther
        
        You must be an Obama supporter.
      - petroskhan
        
        I forgive that statement, as it was said in anger, and I'm sure in your personal life you try to be a good person.
      - Esther
        
        LOL, you also disingenuous
      - petroskhan
        
        It's called honesty. You Mormons should try it some time. It feels good, speeds up discussions on important topics, and actually conveys information to those who request it.
        
        God Bless.
      - Esther
        
        as I said, you are
        disingenuous and not to be trusted
      - petroskhan
        
        Of course you can't trust me. I am open, honest, and answer questions when asked. I provide information about my beliefs and my faith when people request it. I explain the foundations of my faith, and take the time to show the how and why of my faith.
        
        My goodness, how on earth could you ever trust someone like that?
      - Esther
        
        You also have trouble reading simple instructions. I bet you're heard that before!
      - petroskhan
        
        No, I really don't…and haven't.
        
        Bet I'll bet you've heard many times that you have trouble answering simple questions, right?
        Your lack of belief and faith in God is very discouraging, and I frankly
        am tired of trying to get you to answer a few simple questions. This
        is sad, because there is a very real chance we all could have benefited
        from such a discussion. Instead, you thought it better to avoid the
        topic, accuse me of a variety of things, and suggest that since I was
        questioning Mormons (the gall!), I might as well become an atheist.
        Real Christian attitude there. Like I said…no faith.
        
        Look, I'm going to drop this whole back and forth thing. Not one of you has the strength of faith to debate with me. Not one of you has the conviction to answer some simple questions regarding your faith. Not one of you is committed to God enough to even attempt to discuss Him.
        
        I'm done.
      - Esther
        
        Good
      - http://www.facebook.com/jeffrey.dixon.509 Jeffrey Dixon
        
        I am also open, honest and answer questions when asked. Yet I would be surprised if you considered me to be trustworthy.
      - petroskhan
        
        I trust you insofar as you are exactly who you say you are. You're consistent, you don't evade direct questions, and you can maintain a civil tone, when addressed with one. Points for you, Jeff.
      - Esther
        
        None to you petroskhan. Jeff Dixon is far and away your superior
      - petroskhan
        
        Well, there you have, better than I could put into words, the Mormon philosophy. When questioned, run away, and refer to someone who follows the Bible as being beneath an atheist.
        
        I do believe you just made my point for me. Thanks.
        
        By the way, all that hatred, hostility and anger…they teach you that in your "temple", or did your nightly communion with Satan provide that training?
      - Bar-Eliam
        
        You are both wrong. I understand petroskhan is a JW and Esther is a moron…ahhhhh I mean a mormon.
      - Esther
        
        And you are another Obama supporter?
      - Bar-Eliam
        
        No we are genital supporters!
      - Esther
        
        listra the alinskyite, from the chicago/BHO group… how much money are we taxpayers paying you for your services to disrupt this great country listra?
      - Bar-Eliam
        
        Sorry, but I am not Lizzy just one of the group. How much money do we get?
        Millions and millions….nooooo….make that billions and billions as my old friend and former prof Dr. Carl Sagan used to say.
        The only disruption would be in making a lying cultist like Maromney into a president in this the United States where he would ruin this country from one end to another. Fortunately he would be thrown out of office before he could figure out what has happened. How many sister wives do you have? 40 or 50 between all of you that we have to support while you give the tiny bit of money you have to your so-called church…what a laugh.
        Jesus Christ wouldn't recognize your stakes, wards and temples as a religious community if he way one. You are just a bunch of crazed and delusional people who could be led anywhere.
      - Esther
        
        So Carl Sagan is one of the progeny of Alinsky or is that another of your made-up stories. For someone who hates the Mormon I gather you must have been turned down as a leader of a bunch of wives. lol
      - Bar-Eliam
        
        I don't hate morons oh I mean mormons. They are rapidly heading into their lives of eternal destruction. Why would I be turned down by a bunch of wives. Sorry I don't believe in your virtues of multiple wives which usually when investigated seems to be a bunch of under-aged girls. Look what has happened to your recent leaders. They are in the resorts run by the federal prisons.
      - Esther
        
        NOT SO listra, they are men who followed Alinsky. Multiple wives went out of style with us Mormons in 1890. tsk tsk you may have been a good student according to idiot Alinsky but you would have failed my class.
      - Bar-Eliam
        
        SIR:
        You HAVE no class!
      - Esther
        
        lol.. you wish!
      - Esther
        
        Bar, listra: Why do y'all kill people who disagree with you?
      - http://www.facebook.com/jeffrey.dixon.509 Jeffrey Dixon
        
        Are you a Muslim?
      - Bar-Eliam
        
        Why would you ask?
      - http://www.facebook.com/jeffrey.dixon.509 Jeffrey Dixon
        
        Sagan is hardly of the progeny of Alinsky. He is an Atheist, but more importantly, he is a scientist.
      - Esther
        
        Well then it is one of listra's (aka Bar-A) made-up stories… Who is an Atheist? Sagan? I know he is a scientist, physicist.
      - Jeff Dixon
        
        Yes, Sagan. Actually more of an Agnostic, but still not a believer.
      - Esther
        
        The only information I recall is a book he wrote while I was in school: Contact. I read the book because it was about a female physicist. Set in Arizona. My only recall of the story: it is
        about extraterrestrial intelligence, signal monitoring of space for life, maybe (?.) I heard about Sagan but I have no knowledge of his science or his atheism or his popularity…other than to recognize his name. What is his real contribution, if any, Jeff?
      - http://www.facebook.com/jeffrey.dixon.509 Jeffrey Dixon
        
        Carl Edward Sagan ( /ˈseɪɡən/; November 9, 1934 – December 20, 1996) was an American astronomer, astrophysicist,cosmologist, author, science popularizer, and science communicator in astronomy and natural sciences. He spent most of his career as a professor of astronomy at Cornell University where he directed the Laboratory for Planetary Studies. He published more than 600 scientific papers[2] and articles and was author, co-author or editor of more than 20 books. He advocated scientifically skeptical inquiry and the scientific method, pioneered exobiology and promoted the Search for Extra-Terrestrial Intelligence (SETI).
        Sagan is known for his popular science books and for the award-winning 1980 television series Cosmos: A Personal Voyage, which he narrated and co-wrote.[3]
        
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carl_Sagan
      - http://www.facebook.com/dorothy.m.wood Mary Wood
        
        I wonder just what his highly technical science is like: Of course, "scientifically skeptical inquiry" is what all science is supposed to engender in my experience; I would be curious what he actually contributed to "the scientific method," also well established long before him, yet, I have not before heard of "exobiology." what have you heard about him, I mean publically, did you know him before, since he has a similar philosophical view to yours?
      - http://www.facebook.com/dorothy.m.wood Mary Wood
        
        Sort of like you, Jeff, as I understand you. Can you relate to this statement?: "My parents were not scientists. They knew almost nothing about science. But in introducing me simultaneously to skepticism and to wonder, they taught me the two uneasily cohabiting modes of thought that are central to the scientific method."
      - Bar-Eliam
        
        Dr. Carl Sagan was an Astrophysicist. He was one of the very best.
        He dealt in reality that is in real planets not the ones you brain dead morons/mormons think you will live on. It is no wonder you know nothing of him.
        He did attend the same school in which Dr. Saul Alinsky taught and I do believe he had several classes with him on social justice.
        Obviously you haven't heard but he is now dead. Looks as though a couple of his children will be taking his place in science.
      - Esther
        
        I see, You know-it-all and everyone. Interesting.
      - DStaton
        
        By the way, I've noticed you have changed names yet again. DWOODPC, DWOOD, Etc.etc.etc.
        Why do you change identies so often??
        Are you afraid your stake president will catch you???
        You should be, because I know who you really are and I am reporting your every post to tthe proper authorities,
        Your leaders are not amused, and action will be taken…
      - Esther
        
        We have followers. Thank you, DStaton! We love fans.
      - Guest
        
        And you must be an Obama supporter?
      - petroskhan
        
        Guess the being wrong club has a new member! LOL
        
        I am NOT, by any stretch of the imagination, a J-Dub. Those guys are way off base, too. About as far from Christian as Mormons, if you ask me.
      - Esther
        
        You are not a Christian. Mormons are Christians.
      - petroskhan
        
        HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!! According to WHOM? LOLOLOL
        
        Yeah, you're "Christians" who believe that God is married (with no Biblical support), that God was once a man, that you will one day BE god, that Smith was a prophet (yet fails every test of a prophet), the Book of Mormon is inspired by God (yet it contradicts the Bible). Shall I go on?
        
        You're a CULT. A cult of hateful, evasive, deceitful LIARS. And I will continue to point that out, and prove it to all. And that, simply because not ONE of you would answer a few simple questions. I would have let it go, but you chose to evade, dissemble, and insult rather than engage in a simple dialog. You had a chance to be constructive, to help form my opinion. It was in your hands, and like I said, a favorable opinion I had held for DECADES was destroyed in two days by your attitude.
        
        Good job.
      - Esther
        
        Petroskhan is all about disseminating false anti-Mormon literature. I knew this from square one. And he spent many hours trying to trap me so finally he could divulge his true nature, while at the same time self-professing his superiority, repeatedly indicating no such ulterior motive. I knew better, and here is the proof.. QED Case closed.
      - Bighoss
        
        It is easy to call someone a liar instead of making a credible effort to rebut the information he has posted. Esther. It is obvious that you have chosen the first course, since you are unable to show that documented information about Mormonism, based on Mormon sources, is anything but true. Your impotent polemical strategy is typical of Mormons who can't or won't deal honestly with the facts about their homespun cultic belief system.
      - Esther
        
        LOL it is easy to call a liar, a liar. Profound.
      - Vladimir
        
        Hi there Bighoss. I can deal honestly with the facts about our belief. Here it is. Are you ready? The Lord restored His Church on the earth in 1830. He caused the Book of Mormon to be written in ancient times and brought forth in our day. To KNOW that these two facts are true is priceless. The only way that you or anyone can KNOW that these facts are true is to inquire of the Lord. Once you have the truth FROM THE LORD, you are ready for more. You don't, so you aren't. You are condemned to bluster, accuse, display your ignorance and ignore the Lord.
      - Bighoss
        
        Ah, yes, the old Mormon dodge. When you have no substantive answer, you fall back on that old weak chestnut–that if one asks God, God will tell him that Joseph Smith was an honest-Injun real prophet and the Book of Mormon is true. If I were a Mormon with all the sordid history and well-documented bogus theology they have to try to defend, I too would look for that kind of cheap, shabby, anti-intellectual easy out.
      - Vladimir
        
        Wow, Bighoss, I never considered any guidance in the Bible to be cheap, shabby or anti-intellectual. Can I quote you on that?
      - Bighoss
        
        It is one thing to be guided by the Bible. It is something else altogether to distort Bible teaching in a flawed effort to substantiate flawed beliefs.
        
        James 1:5 is not intended to provide confirmation of doctrines or beliefs that are clearly inconsistent with inspired scripture. If a Mormon asks, nothing doubting, for God to tell him whether Joseph Smith was a true prophet and if the "answer" he receives is "Yes," then it was not God who gave the answer; it was the Mormon's emotional desire to have his feelings confirmed.
      - Vladimir
        
        Bighoss, James said that God will give you wisdom. How can you believe that God won't, but some other source will? You are directly counter to the Bible.
      - Bighoss
        
        It is one thing to rely on the Bible for guidance. It is something else altogether to distort scripture in a transparent effort to justify one's cultic beliefs. If a Mormon asks, nothing doubting, whether Joseph Smith was truly a prophet of God and whether the Book of Mormon is true, and if the "answer" he gets is in the affirmative, then all that is satisfied in such a transaction is a reinforcing of that Mormon's emotionally-held but heretical beliefs.
      - Bighoss
        
        "Bluster"??? I will SHOW you bluster of the most extreme kind, right from the twisted mind and lying lips of that varmint, Joseph Smith, Jr. I gotcha BLUSTER right hea-a-a-h!
        
        "
        
        Statements made by Joseph Smith about himself
        
        <<<>>>
        
        Now THAT, Vlad, is world-class blustering!
      - petroskhan
        
        ROFL!!!
        
        "Petroskhan is all about disseminating false anit-Mormon literature." LOLOL
        
        All I've quoted during this discussion is YOUR literature, and statements made by YOUR people! You're cracking me up, Esther! Joseph Smith's writings are "anti-Mormon literature"? Hey, good to know!! Brigham Young's writings are anti-Mormon?
        
        Oh, I know, it must be the quotes from the BIBLE that I used. Well, now…there you might have a point. The Bible IS anti-Mormon. You've got me there.
      - Esther
        
        Petroskhan: The best word I can come up with for your idiot convolutions is simply… idiot.
      - petroskhan
        
        I do admire your persistence is NOT answering questions, NOT addressing any issues I've raised, and being insulting when you're questioned.
        
        Is insulting, angry behavior your usual recourse when someone disagrees with you?
        
        How about, just to be different, you actually ANSWER A QUESTION? It's a simple one. Here goes…
        
        What "false anti-Mormon literature" have I disseminated?
      - Esther
        
        I have answered the very question you asked. You are just too dense to understand something your should understand from your own stated scriptural sources.
        
        I don't have to justify accusing you of false Mormon literature you have disseminated, it is in the record.
      - petroskhan
        
        What's "in the record" is the fact that you, Esther, are a liar. And not a very good one, either.
        
        Either prove me wrong, or admit it.
      - petroskhan
        
        Just curious…how is it "convoluted" to quote your own sources, then ask you to explain it?
      - Evermyrtle
        
        Some Mormons refuse to even look at the truth, to say nothing about believing the truth.
      - Esther
        
        This is you judgement of any Mormons after your investigation of Petroskhan's stance? So be it, Myrtle. I am duly warned.
      - Evermyrtle
        
        I really know nothing about Petroskhan, I get my Information from GOD'S ENTIRE WORD, on worldly things I go to the proper website. I do not believe stuff I read on here unless there is proof. Of course I do believe things people tell me about their thoughts or beliefs, not what anyone says about somebody else's religions or stuff like that.
      - dionesius3
        
        A MORON is not and will NEVER be a Christian. The two are mutually exclusive. It say very plainly in the introduction to your book of Morons that "Christian" churches are all wrong and all apostate. The inbred joseph smith started his own religion from totally new cloth.
        You can't claim to be "Christian" because you don't know or follow Christ. You follow heavenly father, who can't control anything including his own children Ie Lucifer.
      - Bar-Eliam
        
        Excellent retorts and they contain too much truth for the morons/moromney/lds'ers
        to absorb. This person with its multiple personalities is unable to respond in truth and fact because it has never been taught the same.
        They recite, like parrots, everything they are told. A great example of mass brain washing.
        Congratulations on knowing you subjects.
      - Evermyrtle
        
        You right to a point, until you get to the FATHER, GOD. GOD, not have control!! Who do you think has prevented the world from destroying it self these last few years? And if JESUS does not come back sooner than HE first planned, mankind will destroy it, because GOD will allow it. But JESUS is coming back, very soon.
        
        Why do you think HE is our of control of?. HE does not mean to control our every move. He gives us a choice to live however we want to. This prevents us from being robots. We will be rewarded by whoever we chose to live for, in the hereafter. GOD'S rewards are wonderful, the other choice is doubtful..
        
        You can believe correctly, "GOD IS IN CONTROL!"
      - Esther
        
        Dionesius3: Really? I love the Mormons, and so do you. You hate it that they treat you so well. They would probably help you to move into a neighborhood of people just like yourself, There must be neighborhoods with people just like you somewhere around there. I imagine it would be like Whoville. You know those people would understand you better. Only if you wanted to do so, of course.
      - DStaton
        
        Why not answer these truths???
        
        Are you afraid???
        
        How do you know when a Mormon is lying??
        
        ANY TIME THEY SPEAK!!!
        
        You say you believe the Bible "so far as it is correctly translated"
        
        Those are your words lying Mormon. You do not believe the Bible is ever "correctly" translated.
        And further more, you act as if the translation of scripture has ANYTHING WHATSOEVER to do with trash moron doctrine.
        
        Mormons do not believe the Bible, they reinterpret the Bible based on their own trash scriptures and you are told over and over that ANYTIME the Bible disagrees with your moron Mormon doctrine then that portion of the Bible is corrupted and the book of morons, or doctrine and covens, or the pearl of great harlotry, is where you should look for the "truth"
        
        You offer lip service to the Bible, but when it comes down to it, your own trash takes preeminence over the Bible EVERYTIME!!!
        
        Now speak again so everyone reading these posts can see your lies for what they are.
        
        Tell me again how Mormons love the Bible, because you know and I know that the Bible means ABSOLUTELY nothing to Mormons. Except as a tool to deceive weak people into believing that Mormonism is a Christian religion.
        
        Mormons are not Christians!!!
        
        The god of Mormonism is NOT THE GOD OF THE BIBLE.
        
        The God of the Bible affirms again and again that he is NOT A MAN..
        
        The moron Mormon god says he is a man and that all men may become a god.
        
        That is not the same God as what you find in the Bible.
        
        The moron Mormon god has sex with heavenly mother/s who bear "spirit children" who become the souls in babies born on earth.
        
        The God of the Bible does not have a wife, and does not need a wife to "create" the human soul.
        
        The god of moron Mormonism says you must wear holy underwear, loving called "g&#039s" by moron Mormons. If you don&#039t wear them everyday then you will not become a god.
        And they have special powers too.
        
        The God of the Bible has never and will never require such stupidity of his followers.
        
        Grow up for goodness sakes and recognize the VAST difference between these two beliefs.
      - Esther
        
        Your silly pathway to truth is noted. You are also, not a Christian.
      - Esther
        
        You've got all the anti-Church of Jesus Christ tales told by others down pat. Why don't you come up with something on your own. Didn't you learn about plagiarism is any of your classes? Remember this one: Thou shall not steal? How about: Thou shall not bear false witness?
        
        Mormons are the true Christians.
      - DStaton
        
        Seems to me you have a corner on the market of "thou shalt not lie" .
        You have done nothing but lie from your first post until this post.
        You lie and say your moron church worships the God of the Bible. We all know that to be a lie. The God of the Bible is a totally different God from your moron "Heavenly Father", who eats, sleeps, has sex, and poops in a heavenly toilet.
        Not to mention that you lie concerning your church's practices in the temple ceremonies, what your taught there, and what you wear under you clothes, you lie to those you witness to as well by telling them that the LDS church is a "Christian" church.
        
        There is NOTHING "Christian" in the moron church except the few common names that your church lie about and hide behind. Your "Jesus" is not the Jesus found in the Bible, your "Jesus" is a fictional brother of Lucifer, and a liar who told different stories to the Jews and the native Americans.
        
        Your the most pathetic excuse for a "loving human being" ever, and you can rest assured you will pay for the damages you have done to innocent people by telling your vile lies.
        
        I feel sorry for you because you think you know God, but you only know a false god you call "Heavenly Father". And it's likely not even your fault, you likely fell victim to the mind-control techniques of your cult without ever recognizing what was happening to you.
        
        Your a sad, and tragic, mental and emotional basket-case who is so programmed that you can see the truth right in front of your face.
        
        The evidence is overwhelming, you are completely unable to see the facts, or listen to a reasonable, and logical, presentation of the truth about your own church history.
        
        I pray for your deliverance from your mind-controlling cult. May the true God have mercy upon you and enlighten your darkened and twisted mind.
      - Evermyrtle
        
        Did you accept JESUS CHRIST THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD as your SAVIOR???
      - Esther
        
        Hi Myrtle: I learned from my unwavering parents that I do not have to admit anything to anyone about my religion. I told you that before… AND I DO honor my parents! I think that remark was for Petroskhan, not you, don't you see that? Read my conversation with him over the last three days and see what I have had to put up with! Please give me your opinion.
      - Evermyrtle
        
        I knew you wouldn't answer that question! There is nothing about my religion that I am ashamed to answer.
      - Esther
        
        But I did Myrtle!!! And gave you a clue to find the proof!!! Do you have an aversion to proof?
      - Evermyrtle
        
        What proof? The Sermon on the Mount is no longer accepted by Mormons, that JESUS CHRIST is or is not the only BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD?
      - Esther
        
        Will you PLEASE stop spreading things you know nothing about?
      - Esther
        
        Honor thy Father and thy Mother, takes precedence over Myrtle, Myrtle.
      - Evermyrtle
        
        The first commandment which is the "great commandment"says, THOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD THY GOD WITH ALL THY HEART, ALL THE MIND AND ALL THY SOUL. It is absolutely necessary to honor your parents, they can lead you up in the way you ought to go, but your parents cannot save you but GOD can
      - Esther
        
        Honor thy Father and thy Mother, takes precedence over Myrtle, Myrtle.
      - Evermyrtle
        
        Oh yes, indeed I know whose name was there, I was just joining in with my tidbit which I thought was an interesting point, like those I have joining in on my conversation, which I do not mind,even if they were adverse to my opinion. I do not mind answering questions, will not dodge any questions, if I have the information that one needs.
      - Bar-Eliam
        
        A very correct guess…you are not guessing it is the truth.
        If you are not part of the ELLECT 144,000 you will just be staying around here with the rest of who have the good sense to find better ways to heaven or a philosophy of life.
        Good to see thinking people here. What is terribly sad is the thought that Moromney and Lian Ryan might gain control.
        In this situation it is better to know the devil one knows then get one that is so off base.
      - Evermyrtle
        
        The very thing is that so many people do not to know who JESUS CHRIST, THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD IS. Like this they do not know the joy of living for HIM and being rewarded in the great hereafter by HIM.
      - Bar-Eliam
        
        Get outta here Oester my master is satain not his. He is ours you know him as the brother to the jesus christer.
      - Esther
        
        And you are a story teller out of Islam?
      - Bar-Eliam
        
        How can you call moronisim a faith…they don't have a faith they only have a pack of lies made out of whole cloth by a well known schizophrenic. What can you expect. When you find the golden tablets you will win a set of magikal underwear.
      - Esther
        
        Another know-it-all, a little divide and conquer from the Obama camp?
      - Esther
        
        Why this can only be our Alinskyite listra, am I right B-E?
      - millergroup2
        
        HeHeHeHe!!!!!!!!! :-) :-) :-) I owe you another beer.
      - Vladimir
        
        Petroskhan, how many times are you going to insinuate that God has revealed to you that the Book of Mormon "is wrong", without actually saying that God has.
        
        If you honestly believe that God doesn't answer prayer by revealing truth today that is not mentioned in the Bible. If you believe that God has stopped using His prophets to counsel, enlighten and direct his children in these latter days. If you believe that you are so wise you do not need to go to Him for wisdom. Then why are you so demanding that Mormons give you answers that are based on what we claim are God's revelations to the world in modern times?
        
        We believe that God still reveals knowledge and wisdom He wants us to have. We believe that He is not muzzled as modern theologians insist. And we believe that you, petroskhan, have a right to ignore His modern pronouncements. But Mormons have a right point out what you are doing. You are attacking His revelations all the while refusing to ask Him if those are His revelations.
        
        When you can swallow your pride, humble yourself and actually go to God with real intent, with a sincere heart and faith in Jesus Christ, He will answer you and then you won't have to ask Mormons, anymore. Because you will KNOW directly from God. And I'll bet you won't argue with Him.
      - dionesius3
        
        God has revealed to EVERYONE that the book of Morons is wrong.
        EVERYONE who reads the trash contained in the book of morons can readily see how false and stupid it is, unless they have been "programed" or "brain-washed" to believe by the mormon Cult.
        And Petroskhan is not WRONG he is 100% correct in asking the questions he asks because they point out the STUPIDITY, and NONSENSICAL, trash that you morons believe and promote daily as being "Christian".
        MORMONS are NOT CHRISTIANS!!!, never have been and never will be, you worship a false god who is made in the image of a man. This false god has sex with a heavenly mother and produces spirit babies. He is a weak, timid, and feeble god who can't keep control of his own household, and who is so feeble that he must often sleep, go to the bathroom, and eat.
        By the way this false god of you morons also lives near a star called KOLOB???
        Which means he CAN NOT be OMNIPRESENT, nor can he be ALL-Powerful.
        He also is not ABOVE or in CONTROL of creation, he is living within creation which means he COULD NOT HAVE CREATED it.
        And by the way, we don't fear dying and standing before GOD, because we Christians worship the only GOD their is, The god you morons worship is NON EXISTANT, thus we don't fear anything he says or does.
      - Vladimir
        
        Dionesius3, just repeating something doesn't make it true. You and your kind can't seem to stop saying "Mormons are not Christians". Yet you just can't seem to understand why that has a hollow ring and rallies but few.
        
        Anyone sincerely seeking truth, carefully picks his sources. You and your kind say, "look what I found on the internet". Even your interpretations of the Bible are those of others, mostly gleaned from the internet, or your own private interpretations based on your limited knowledge and perspective.
        
        May I recommend that you check your sources and conclusions with one who has all wisdom, knowledge and truth. Reading the book He commissioned is an excellent start, then following the words of His book, ask Him directly.
        
        How easy is that? Only the arrogant, prideful and/or wicked can't seem to bring themselves to do this.
      - millergroup2
        
        Mormon's ARE NOT CHRISTIANS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
      - Esther
        
        THEY ARRRRRRRRRRRRREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
      - Esther
        
        gross and irrefutable ignorance here, again too jaded
      - millergroup2
        
        dionesius3 made a very good presentation of the Mormon cult here Esther, very clear and concise. And so you stated "dionesius3: gross and irrefutable ignorance here, again too jaded"
        
        Is this how you study, and refute the truth someone has spoken? So you just follow along with what your cult says, without even knowing? Your eternity and salvation is surely at stake here. With the millions of factual documents available to counter the Mormon doctrine, can you not get a hint? This is no game here. How dumb can you be?????
      - petroskhan
        
        Okay, Vlad, I'll spell it out for you, since you seem to be asking. If you're not, just ignore the rest of this post, and move along…nothing to see here…
        
        I have prayed for guidance on this matter. I have prayed and asked God to guide me in the right direction regarding the Book of Mormon, during the time I was reading it. There was no writing on the wall, no voice in my ear…just a strong feeling that I was handling and reading something that was not good for me to be involved with. Sort of like the feeling you would get if you were to contemplate touching sticking your hand into a blender. Interesting to know, perhaps, but not good for you…
        
        I do believe that God answers prayer, never said otherwise. As for pride, well, if I had any, in regards to religious matters, it was swallowed long ago. What I won't swallow is a load of anti-Bible, anti-God hogwash. Like the Book of Mormon. It is riddled with flaws, contradictions, and statements contrary to the Bible. If you don't see them, then you haven't read the book. Period.
        
        I'm not attacking God's revelations to anyone. I am attacking a book that is provably WRONG, provably against the Bible, and provably written by someone who had NO connection to God. Joseph Smith was a phony, a false prophet. It is EASILY proven, and only a fool would choose to believe in him. He fails the Biblical test of a prophet, and you well know it. Deny it if you like, but any objective observer will know you for a liar if you claim that he doesn't fail the tests given in the Bible.
        
        And I must point out, Vlad, that the questions I have asked you and the other Mormons on this site are not the sort of questions where I would need guidance from God. I have asked you all questions regarding core beliefs of your founders regarding the nature of God, as professed in their own words. And not one of you has had the courage or conviction in your own faith to answer them. That speaks VOLUMES to me, and anyone else who's been following this exchange.
      - Esther
        
        You prayed and the Holy Spirit did not answer! petroskhan, just keep trying. that's all that is everything. go for it. .
      - petroskhan
        
        So let me see if I can sum this up…
        
        If I don't agree with Joseph Smith, then the Holy Spirit isn't with me, is that about it?
      - Vladimir
        
        Petroskhan, I don't think I know of anyone with more arrogance than one who would say, "the questions I have asked you and the other Mormons on this site are
        not the sort of questions where I would need guidance from God."
        
        And you said it. You think your wisdom is so great you don't need God. In that case you surely don't need answers from mere mortal Mormons. All this time you have been asking questions just to deride the answers. And you said you really wanted to know the answers. Shame on you.
      - petroskhan
        
        Allow me to elaborate, then. Apparently my words insufficiently clear.
        
        When I said I didn't need guidance from God (which statement I do not deny, but rather, stand by), what I meant was, the Bible and the Book of Mormon are very clear on what they say. There is no need for clarification on the contradictions put forth in the Book of Mormon. What I was hoping for was simply an explanation, from someone who believed in the Book of Mormon, as to why those contradictions existed.
        
        Another area where I do not need guidance from God is in the area of the statements of Joseph Smith, Brigham Young and the others I quoted on their idea of the nature and origin of God. I do not believe they were correct, and there is no Biblical support for their contentions; the Bible, in fact, is against their claims. Ergo, I wanted to hear, from a Mormon, their side of the story on this subject.
        
        Please do not misquote what I've said. I've tried very hard to keep this conversation civil. Where I have lapsed, I have apologized. Unfortunately, the effort has not been mutual. If you are, as Esther has said, a "priest" in your church, then you should value honesty, among other things. Can you show me anywhere that I stated that my wisdom was so great that I didn't need God? I can show where I've stated the opposite, as you are well aware. I've not misquoted you, nor applied your words in any sort of twisted meaning. I am, and have been, above board, patient (for the most part), and honest. Can you say the same?
        
        If there is any shame here, it is on all of you. Each one of you has wasted no opportunity to be insulting, evasive, disingenuous, and deceitful. I have asked simple questions which you have refused to answer, claiming that I needed to pray about it, or read a single verse from the Bible which supposedly clears up everything!
        
        Okay, let's see here…
        
        James 1:5
        "But if any of you lacks wisdom, let
        him ask from Elohim, who gives to all
        freely and with grace, and it will be
        given to him."
        
        There's the verse you've been touting as the answer to everything. Now, here's but ONE of my questions:
        If God was once a man on some other world, as Joseph Smith and the others I've quoted have stated, and ascended to His current status, wouldn't that imply that there was someone HE worshiped? Are they now equals? Or is this other being still above God?
        
        Can you show me where in that favored verse of yours where that idea is addressed or answered? Oh, I know what you're going to say. I need to pray about it, and God will let me know the answer, right? Tell me, since you seem to think that your so much wiser than I could ever hope to be, exactly how might God give me that information? A dream, perhaps? A vision? A gut feeling as to the truth?
        
        I'm going to go with that last one. That gut feeling thing. You know why? I've read enough of Joseph Smith's statements to know the man was marching lockstep in the armies of Satan. A more disgusting, arrogant, self-serving load of garbage I've never encountered. And you have the unmitigated gall to refer to that blasphemer as a "prophet"? Shame on YOU, Vlad. Shame on anyone who turns his back on our Creator to follow in the footsteps of that slave of Satan.
        
        And my challenge still remains unanswered by any of you gutless, Godless wonders. Answer just ONE of my questions. Just one. Either answer the questions, or admit you don't have the answers. You're all starting to look pretty foolish here…
      - Vladimir
        
        Petroskhan, you stated, "Can you show me anywhere that I stated that my wisdom was so great that I didn't need God?". Yes. You stated, "…not the sort of questions where I would need guidance from God." You are so sure of yourself that you don't need God. But you seek to test the testimonies of Mormons on what we claim we have received from God. You and I know exactly what you are doing.
        
        You questioned my honesty. I have not been dishonest with you or anyone on this site. I have no motivation or reason to be dishonest. That is an honest answer you'll understand. I know of myself that I have not been dishonest. That is an honest answer for me.
        
        You said, "I have asked simple questions which you have refused to answer,
        claiming that I needed to pray about it, or read a single verse from the
        Bible which supposedly clears up everything!" You almost got it right. However, the verse from the Bible is not what "clears up everything". It is God who will confirm truth to you.
        
        Your question about God is a good one. I too have speculated on the ramifications of that revelation. However, I have already had the more basic question answered by God that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints is His Church on the earth today. You cannot have the meat before you have had the milk. I am sorry if you find that insulting, but if you disagree with me just reread your posts about His Church. Reread what you've said about His prophet, Joseph Smith. I fear you are not even ready for the milk. You seem to be bound up in hate, pride in your learning, contentious and quarrelsome. Not traits that you learned from God.
        
        No Mormon can satisfy your idle curiosity. No Mormon should even try lest you turn and rend them. I don't have the answers you seek. If that makes me look foolish, so be it. I have the answers I have sought from God. And I continually seek further light and knowledge from Him. Because "we believe that He will yet reveal many great and important things pertaining to the Kingdom of Heaven."
        
        I am sorry that you hold the opinions you do. I can only advise you, once again, to go to God for the truth you seek.
      - petroskhan
        
        My goodness, what a lot evasive double-talk.
        
        You know, there's lots of areas of one's life where it is not necessary to ask for God's help. Which clothes should I wear today…which car I should buy…what color should I paint the bathroom…
        
        Now I know you will reply that those are material issues, and not of any spiritual import. So let me put it this way, if this will help.
        
        Joseph Smith claimed that the Book of Mormon was from God. The Bible is from God. The Book of Mormon contradicts the Bible. Which is correct?
        
        Many of the statements and teachings of Joseph Smith are contrary to what is taught in the Bible. Which is correct?
        
        My curiosity is far from "idle". Idle curiosity is wondering how many sodas I have left in the fridge. Idle is wondering what I might feel like having for lunch tomorrow.
        
        The issues I've raised with you and your fellow Smith worshipers are serious ones, worthy of discussion and debate. If you can't see that, then you need to consult with someone above you. You dismiss any and all curiosity, claiming "God will guide me!" as some sort of excuse to blind yourself to the glaring inconsistencies within your belief structure. Had I done that, I would still be an atheist.
        
        When I was about 12, I saw a movie on television with my father. I remember nothing about the move, who starred in it, what it was about; the only thing that has stayed with me all these years is one line from the movie:
        
        "Only the truly faithful dare to question their faith."
        
        That has been one of my guiding principles since then. I question my faith daily; I study to ensure that not only am I following, as best I can, my beliefs, but the Words of God, given in the Bible. I scrutinize myself, I pray for guidance, and always, always ask myself and God if there might something I have missed, something I might be doing wrong.
        
        What I find disheartening is that every one of the Mormons on this discussion board has been so defensive, so full of hostility, that you actually become angry at someone bringing up the possibility that you could be wrong. You're all so insecure, you won't even answer questions about your faith. How on earth can you expect to make progress if you examine your own faith, if you can't even answer questions about it?
        
        I've pointed out serious questions I have. Questions I would still like to have answered. But the very concept of someone questioning you on your faith seems so horrific that all you can do is denigrate, insult, or avoid the topic.
        
        Is that how you're taught in your temples to react when someone has questions? Misdirect, avoid, and then attack? How does that help someone? What goal is being really served by that sort of attitude?
        
        You're not going to get anywhere blinding yourself like that. If you don't ask questions, you'll never get answers.
      - Vladimir
        
        Petroskhan, I agree with your statement, "If you don't ask questions, you'll never get answers." But it depends on who you ask whether you get the truth. You keep asking others, when you should be asking God.
        
        We also, believe in proving all things and holding fast to that which is true. We study and study, then ask God. For there is no proof of divine matters had among the children of men except that which God reveals. You can't prove the Bible is true, but God can and does all the time.
        
        Your questions are serious. So serious, in fact, only God can answer them in such a way that you will know the answers are true.
        
        You say I'm defensive. I don't feel defensive. In fact, I trust in God completely. He can defend His Church a lot better than I or any other Mormon. Why don't you go to Him. After all, if I'm defensive, full of hostility, angry, insecure and all I can do is denigrate, insult or avoid the topic, misdirect and then attack, I'm not a very good source. I don't think God would mistreat you like that. And He doesn't lie either, like you say I do. Go to Him, petroskhan, go to Him.
      - petroskhan
        
        I think there is one crucial point you're missing in all of this. All of you.
        
        I'm trying to find out what YOU think. I'm trying to understand YOUR thoughts. You want me to ask God what YOU think about the questions I've posed to you? I've raised the questions because I want answers to them. I know what I believe, and wanted to have a discussion on this topic, because I felt that frank, open discussion might be of benefit. Instead I've been insulted, the issue avoided, and my faith derided. THIS is the attitude that's taught in your faith? Nice.
        
        I go to God for His wisdom, for His guidance. I went to Mormons to find out what Mormons think. Since all I got in reply was…well…what I got, I guess I do know what you all think, don't I?
      - Vladimir
        
        Thank you for finally revealing your true intentions. You never did want wisdom from God. How unfortunate for you.
        
        I'm not in the business of debating points of doctrine with someone who has labeled me, "insulting, evasive, disingenuous, and deceitful". Nor can I fathom why someone who considers me such would want anything to do with me.
        
        But not to leave you hanging, you may go to mormon.org to learn what I believe. You may also read the Book of Mormon because I believe it was commissioned of God. I also believe all that God has revealed and what He will reveal.
        
        Unlike you, I have worked hard for my knowledge and I am thankful for the wisdom God has given me. Your level of understanding about His church is very low based on your postings about it. Your knowledge about His church is also very different from mine. This is due to your choice of sources. The ultimate source, of course, is God, whom you refuse to consider.
        
        Therefore the "frank, open discussion" that you are itching to start would only serve to amuse you and provide a forum for you to deride God's Church and His revelations to the world. I don't want to be a part of that. I would be accountable, whereas you in your ignorance would not.
      - petroskhan
        
        I think you've got things a bit bass-ackwards here, Vlad.
        
        I labeled you (the collective "you", not the personal "you") as "insulting, evasive, disingenuous and deceitful" BECAUSE you avoid the questions. You're not avoiding them because I called you that. Had you simply answered them, as any normal person would, especially one of faith, then I would be left with no option to label you as honest, forthright and open.
        
        As to why I would want anything to do with you, I am curious as to how someone who is so fervently devoted to someone who is provably a false prophet would still want to follow him. I am curious as to how one balances the contradictions between the Book of Mormon and the Bible. I am curious as to the Mormon explanation of the nature of God. This information I cannot find on your website. Yes, I've looked. I simply have questions, questions that I feel should (and could) be answered in a civil fashion, by any civil person.
        
        Instead, I've been insulted, lied to, and had my questions avoided and belittled. Why you're all so against an open discussion of your own faith is beyond me. The only excuse I can come up with is you're either embarrassed by it, or you have something to hide. I can see no other reason for so vigorously avoiding a discussion on the topic of your faith. If there is one, I am open to hearing it.
        
        To be clear, I have NO desire to ridicule. I have NO desire to play the "my faith is better than your faith" game. Nor do I wish to insult anyone. My faith is not your faith. Yours is not mine. We both know that. But having different faiths (or opinions regarding faith) does no negate the possibility of civil discourse on the subject. This is not a game for me, as you seem to think. I do enjoy discussions on important topics (politics, religion, science), but I don't get any sort of kicks from insulting people, or being insulted.
        
        Faith is a very serious topic; we should all feel strongly about it, or not at all. As Jesus said, He would rather we were hot or cold. As such, I can see where feelings can get the better of us. But our fervor doesn't mean we can't discuss that faith, or defend it against opposing viewpoints.
      - Vladimir
        
        My only motivation in discussing with you the doctrines of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints would be that you could come to know that it is the true church of God.
        
        I've looked over your past posts. I don't think you can overcome the level of hate you feel towards the Lord's Church.
        
        However, the devices you employed to try and get me to engage you were amusing. They were reminiscent of a child trying everything in his repertoire to get his way. Challenging, deriding, insulting, sincerity, seriousness, appealing to the compassionate nature, but the best one was threatening to not vote for Romney because Mormons on this site wouldn't do want you wanted them to do.
        
        I think you are out of gas on this one, petroskhan. Retracing old ground won't do it. So unless you have something new in your arsenal, you've given it your best try, but in the end you came up short.
      - petroskhan
        
        Interesting admission there, Vlad. You only discuss your religion with someone who agrees with you? I appreciate the admission of insecurity. It's one of the more honest things any of you Mormons has had the courage to say thus far.
        
        As for my feelings towards "the Lord's Church", I have nothing but love for it. Unfortunately, that Church is NOT the Mormon Church. However, whatever you choose to call your cult, I don't hate you, it, or any member of it. I would ask you peruse the posts I've been the target of, posts from members of your faith. I have been insulted, told I might as well be an atheist, and called an idiot, just because I had the temerity to disagree with you. Is that what is taught in your faith? Insult, ridicule and insult those who disagree with you? Is that what our Savior did?
        
        I have shown you ample evidence that Joseph Smith was a fraud. You've refused to address it.
        
        I've posed questions based on the writings of your own founder. You've refused to address them.
        
        I've raised issues with core doctrines of the Mormon Church. You've refused to addressed them.
        
        As for my voting comment, that was no threat. I see a very real threat in having someone with that same mindset occupying the Oval Office. Ron Paul may not win, but from the attitudes I've been the target of on this forum, I can not, as a Christian, take part in putting someone in office who holds those same values.
        
        And since you've gone over the posts, Vlad, ask yourself one thing. Has any one of you, at any time, come close to actually addressing any single issue I've raised? The honest answer is, you haven't. You know it, I know it, and everyone else here has been witness to your fervid attempts to avoid answering a single question or issue I've raised. For everyone to see, it is clear that you are running from any discussion of the issues. You are hiding behind your presumptuous facade of moral superiority, but your true cowardice and fear shine through for all to see. If you had half the faith in your beliefs you wish you did, you would not hesitate to discuss your faith, to display, for everyone to see, the power of your conviction, and the justifications for it. You would, in fact, follow the Bible's teachings on the subject.
        
        1 Peter 3:15
        "But sanctify the Messiah as Sovereign in your hearts, and always
        be ready to give an answer to everyone asking you a reason concerning the
        hope of your faith, with meekness and fear"
        
        But you, sir, are a coward. You lack the conviction to proudly show the basis and superiority of your faith, since, as we both know, it does not exist. So, go on, cowering behind your phony airs, and tell yourself that such an open discussion is beneath you, or that you have some lofty reason for not presenting your reasons for your faith.
        
        But anyone can see you for the cowards you all are, and how sadly you fail to follow the very Scriptures in which you claim to believe.
        
        Okay, bring on the next set of excuses…
      - Esther
        
        The more I hear you the more I love Joseph Smith… go figure..
      - petroskhan
        
        Esther, I worry about you, and so many like you.
        
        History, the Bible, and your own faith's documents show beyond any question or doubt that Smith was a false prophet, and spoke things which were untrue, even blasphemous. But you stubbornly choose to believe them, and to not even question them. And when questioned, you reply with bitterness, violence and insults. I know you probably feel that your harsh words were justified in some way, or even provoked. If I had any part in "egging you on" or provoking you to such un-Christian behavior, a possibility I admit is quite high, I do apologize. I will pray on this, you have my word.
        
        I've gone through phases in this exchange. First, minor objective curiosity, then stubbornness in wanting an answer, after that annoyance and perhaps even "petulance", I'll admit that. Then I became fascinated with how not one of you seemed capable of even the slightest self-examination. This may have caused you to feel attacked, or insulted in some way. If so, again, I apologize.
        
        I am done, though. I am now simply at the stage where I am truly and deeply concerned for all of you. I will not bother you anymore, but I will continue to feel deeply disappointed in how little eagerness I see for personal and spiritual growth or introspection.
        
        You will claim that you are growing, I am sure. But doesn't growth start with questions? Doesn't it start with wondering if you're doing the best you can, and following the right doctrine?
        
        Let me give you an example, if I may. Up until I was around 18 or so, I was, at best, ambivalent in regards to religion. At that time, I became a Seventh-Day Adventist (I know, I know). For almost 30 years I was a member, feeling as though I was tapped into a great truth that others were missing. Finally, I started to REALLY study the Bible, digging deep into it, and praying…a LOT. I realized that too often, when I presented facts from history and the Bible to Adventists, the answer was "Well, Ellen White says…" They put her writings over and above, or at least as an excuse for ignoring, what the Bible clearly commanded. I started to study her life and writings, and found that she prophesied many things which never came to pass. This marks her, according to the Bible, as a false prophet.
        
        It caused me great pain, but I was forced to sever my association with the Church after many years. I could no longer take part in their false doctrine. Together with a few others, I left, and we now have our weekly meetings here in my house. We study together, critically and openly, digging for the truth about what God wants for us. We frequently disagree, and that promotes more questions, prayer, and a search for answers. I can honestly say I get more spiritual fulfillment out a single meeting now than I did in a year at that church.
        
        The point is, Esther, I was (and am) willing to question myself. I was willing to take a very long-held belief and subject it to intense scrutiny. I was unflinching in that pursuit of the truth, and found a great deal that I didn't like, but I kept at it because that is what we are commanded to do (1 Thess 5:21 "Prove all things, hold fast that which is good."), and it is the essence of personal growth.
        
        And so, as I said, I worry about you. None of us should be irritated or defensive when our faith is questioned. It should be seen as a chance to promote that faith, to further our own knowledge of our faith by explaining it. We are to be teachers, bringing knowledge to others, not hiding that candle under a basket, as it were.
        
        But, you will do as you must, just as we all will. But I implore you, not to answer me, but yourself. I don't want any answers, Esther. In fact, were I to ask for one, you would, based on the errors I've committed thus far, see it as another attempt to drag you into a conversation you're unwilling to have. Therefore I will be clear – I want NO answers to the things I've posed here. I would just implore you to dig. For you own benefit, not my curiosity. Dig into your faith, have courage, and pray for guidance.
        
        You will all be in my prayers.
        
        With love and friendship…God Bless.
      - Evermyrtle
        
        Won't be much reward in the hereafter unless you profess that 'JESUS CHRIST IS THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD"
      - Esther
        
        Have you joined the true Church of Jesus Christ?
      - Esther
        
        Vladimir: petrskhan is too jaded to understand his own scriptural sources.
      - millergroup2
        
        Can you provide some scriptural sources for you belief? Show that the book of moron's is from God……..You cannot, and this is why you never answer question or try to prove otherwise. You and Vladimir both. Educate us……..
      - Esther
        
        Actually there are two: James 1:5 and Moroni 10:4, Millers
      - millergroup2
        
        Well that was a well thought out dissertation on your knowledge of the super cult. The book of James concerning that verse says nothing about your cult. And who the heck is Moroni?
      - Esther
        
        To which cult to subscribe?
      - petroskhan
        
        The word you want to use is not "jaded"…it's "informed".
      - Esther
        
        That's JADED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!PETROSKHAN
      - millergroup2
        
        Outside the word of God, there are no truths. If it is not written within his word, it is false. Can you name just one thing that a latter day prophet has revealed that has come to pass? Just one? Anything? The Mormon Cult is just one big false prophecy! Others…..one great big lie. And Satan is known as the "father of lies".
        
        Like myself, Petroskhan has ask over and over for you Mormons to state why the Mormon cult should be recognized. You and/or any other Mormon have never offered information to substantiate your claim that the Mormon church is of the God of Abraham, Issac, and Joesph. The god you speak of is an illusion manifested by the pretend to be god…..Satan. Petroskhan is correct, you cannot answer questions directed toward your cult, because you are confused, and have no answers to give, other than the brainwashed responses you are taught. You have no mind of your own. You are floating in a barrel of lies and deceit.
        It is your fault because you refuse to set that stupid book of Mormon aside, and study the truth. Until you learn the truth you will remain confused and lost.
      - Bar-Eliam
        
        These people who appear to be nice beyond nice are nothing more than mind controlled and brain washed to the max. They truly are partners in the Stockholm
        findings.
        It is sad to see so many who are truly lost to a valid way of life and a life here after and would rather live a lie.
      - Esther
        
        Bar-e is listra from the Obama camp. An Alinskyite!
      - Buddy
        
        Wow, denial is not a river in Egypt. How can so many believe in a science fiction story like the Book of Mormon.
      - Bar-Eliam
        
        May we, my group and I, second that statement.
        They are hiding something and it isn't under the long skirts their poor women who are held in abject slavery wear.
      - Esther
        
        Your group is obviously monitoring America. Are you from the Obama camp?
      - Esther
        
        never mind I know your are listra the alinskyite
      - Esther
        
        listra the alinskyite
      - Bar-Eliam
        
        My my miss godless or should I make that the many headed god worshiping beehive singing getting stung by your own words and beliefs.
        You many yet come to your senses.
        Although, that may be impossible as you seem to lack sense of any-kind.
        A follower of JS the common criminal and snake oil salesman usually have already parted from any normal brain function.
      - Bar-Eliam
        
        Sorry just one of the many very happy Alinskyites. We have never used that term but will adopt is as one given us by a follower of the most apostate religions in this world.
        I can only wish I were the Listra.
      - Esther
        
        You are listra, unless you have mind meld, not just another of the volume of Alinsky progeny? Look on the web. You are well known.
      - Esther
        
        Thanks so much Petroskhan, you play Americans right into the hands of Obama. How civil of you.
      - Bar-Eliam
        
        Why don't you just sign off and go and find some innocent Jewish victims of the holocaust to baptize. They would not have wanted it in life and in death you dishonor them.
        Karma and the prophets will deal with you and yours. You will be under the Seal of Abraham.
      - Esther
        
        Are you from the Obama camp???
      - petroskhan
        
        Do I see myself in there? No, I don't. Because I follow, as closely as I can, the teachings of the Bible. I didn't decide to toss it out because something newer came along, pitched by a charlatan that appealed to my ego by claiming that I could become equal to my Creator.
        
        Why is it you are all so blind to the fact that your so-called "prophet" was WRONG? On numerous occasions. That is the definition of a false prophet, isn't it?
        
        You know where I see a description of you Smith worshipers?
        2 Timothy
        "2 Preach the Word! Stand by it in season and out of season. Convict, warn, encourage with all patience and teaching.
        3 For a time will be when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own lusts, they will add to themselves extra teachers according to their own desires;
        4 and they will turn away their ears from the truth and will be turned aside to fables."
        
        Do you see yourself in there, Vlad? I see a whole church there…
      - Esther
        
        You have shown without a shadow of a doubt that you have no belief or faith let alone communication with the Holy Spirit. You are a fake Christian.
      - petroskhan
        
        Oh, boo hoo hoo…I've failed to impress a Mormon!
        
        Let me re-phrase your comment for you, so that it's more accurate.
        
        "You have shown without a shadow of a doubt that you have no belief or faith in Joseph Smith, let alone communication with his master Satan. You are a fake Mormon."
        
        There, see how it fits better? Oh, and you still haven't answered even one of my questions. Why would that be? What are you so afraid of?
      - millergroup2
        
        After all I thought you Mr Vladimir, are you still trying to push your satanic, phoney cult?
      - Esther
        
        You are the phony Christian, Millers
      - millergroup2
        
        Ditto….Ditto…..Ditto!
      - Esther
        
        Bonnie: Not necessary to respond to Petroskhan. If he were curious, as he says, he would have not asked these dumb questions, as he knows better. If you remember a conference talk by Elder Eyring, he tells us to warn our neighbor when there is danger. :) Just keep that in mind. Ask Jeff and Vladimir, especially. By the way, of course you are right!
      - LouiseCA
        
        Well, have your beef on theological boards, your bashing of Mormons on public boards just turns unbelievers further away from God. They don't understand what it's all about and end up thinking Christians, especially evangelicals, are just mean.
      - petroskhan
        
        Just to ask, since it sort of jumped out at me…isn't this a religious website? So, that would make this a theological board, right? Or am I missing some part of your point?
      - Evermyrtle
        
        Any time we disagree with some fake teaching we are mean. We can't let tis stop us. JESUS CHRIST was very plain in HIS teachings, too.
    - Johnny
      
      But, a Chistian trusts in the work of Christ alone as he died on the cross to cover his sins, and does not trust in his own efforts at all. This is what the Apostle Paul proclaimed. Read Romans, Galatians, Ephesians, and Colossians in particular, for this is what he taught in these letters.
      
      Now, as to voting for a President of the nation, we need a man who does not want to make all people equal in their finances, but a man who wants to give people liberty to work in accord with their abilities without demanding that they give their money to people who do not want to work.
    - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000393158131 Dave Rhodes
      
      Yes, but you cannot earn your way to heaven.. Jesus already paid the price.
      - Johnny Rudick
        
        The baptized Mormon is like any other "Saved" Christian and has a duty to do as Jesus would have him/her do.
        We will be rewarded by our work that we do as Christians as many mansions Jesus has prepared for us and the glory we receive will be as Paul predicted weather it be Gold, Silver or precious stones. I believe representing a glory in Heaven for each of us. There will also be Kingdoms of "Wood, Hay and Stubble for many of us as well.
        I am a Bible believing Christian and i also believe all that God has revealed in these latter days.He will yet reveal many things in the future.
        The Bible has gone through many deceptive hands over the years and so has the Church but God has restored that Church for us today.
        That is the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.
        You will not go to Hell if you ignore this fact but as a Christian you WILL be judged according to your works as a Christian and rewarded accordingly.
        God bless.
        
        1 Corinthians 3:7 So then neither is he that planteth any
        thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the
        increase.
        
        1 Corinthians 3:8 Now he that planteth and he that watereth are
        one: and every man shall receive his own reward according to his
        own labour.
        
        1 Corinthians 3:9 For we are labourers together with God: ye
        are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.
        
        1 Corinthians 3:10 According to the grace of God which is given
        unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and
        another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he
        buildeth thereupon.
        
        1 Corinthians 3:11 For other foundation can no man lay than
        that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
        
        1 Corinthians 3:12 Now if any man build upon this foundation
        gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;
        
        1 Corinthians 3:13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for
        the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire;
        and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
        
        1 Corinthians 3:14 If any man's work abide which he hath built
        thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
        
        1 Corinthians 3:15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall
        suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.
      - Mex Seiko
        
        You are either a Baptized Mormon or a Saved Christian. You can't be both. If you are a Baptized Mormon you cannot claim promises and biblical precepts to yourself as your theology of salvation and understanding of the person and nature of God is not in tune with the same Scripture where you pulled those verses you quoted. You can't pick and choose and extract strips of Scripture. The book of Revelation warns about this.
        
        If you have and accept the Bible you do not need any more(mon) confusion.
      - Johnny Rudick
        
        I can see you are very confused.
        Sorry about that.:-(
        We are Christians and I can see so are you.
        The Church has gotten very confused over the nature of the messages of the Bible and has led to beliefs like you hold.
        It is a shame you do not have a living Prophet of God to get you straight.
        But you believe with all your heart that you are sufficient with only the Bible as we have it today, because of the plain and precious messages in the Bible have been changed and dropped by mistake and also vicious men.
        That is regrettable.
        
        the closest to Truth of all the bibles out there today is the King James Bible.
        Stick to it at least.
        I see you have strong faith in Jesus and that will bring you through.
        God bless you and yours.
      - Mex Seiko
        
        I compare the book of Mormon with the Qur'an. They were both written to deceive and to blur the person of Jesus, The Christ, and His gospel. Confusion is what you get when you heed to counterfeit doctrines, which both these books are. The Holy Scriptures, Old and New Testaments are not the work of one single person, but several witnesses, which is God's signature. Unlike Mohammed, Joseph Smith, and I'll throw in James T. Russell, founder of the Jehovah's Witnesses. All three single authors of counterfeit Christianity.
        Satan is a lier and a double talker as evident by your discrediting the state of the Bible while recommending me to read it in one particular form. It's a common practice in politics a well, where lies abound.
        Living prophet? The Bible is our living prophet. You would need to declare the Bible dead in order to replace it with your counterfeit. The Holy Bible has declared the end from the beginning. And today you know your end as prophesied. Unless you repent and come to the knowledge of the truth, you will burn in the lake of fire awaiting that day. Good works and rituals do not assist in salvation. It is acknowledging who you are, who Jesus is, and what He a done to save your souls. You can only achieve this if you understand your sin nature and repent in your heart and ask God for forgiveness accepting Jesus redemption. Mormon and Qur'an do not show this. Only the Holy Bible shows this and straying from God's message leads away from His salvation which we desperately need.
        Edgardo.
      - Johnny Rudick
        
        Yes, the Bible is written by several different authors and over a period of about 4 thousand years.
        I know that.
        I challenge you to compare the various versions of the Bible we have today.
        It will be great Bible study for you.
        Go out and get the best Bible you can find. That will be a King James Bible and then get one of the worse, that would be an NIV, and make some time for quiet Bible study comparing one with the other.
        I will even give you a few verses to start with so yo will not have to do so much work.
        Some have whole paragraphs removed like the last chapter of Mark. they blame this in "better translations . . .' Do not have this or such thing. Some leave out the Blood of Christ as in Acts 20:28. or leave out the fact that Jesus is Jehovah who came to earth and took upon himself Human flesh as in 1 Timothy 3:16. This verse reduces "God" to "He" and changes "manifest in the flesh" to "appeared in a body." This doesn't say the same thing. That is no different from the mount of transfiguration when Moses and Elijah appeared with Jesus. They appeared like men, with bodies. We have Philippians 2: 6 which testifies that Jesus is equal with the Father. 1 Timothy removes the statement in many translations that Jesus Is King of Kings and Lord of Lords and places His Father in that position without any claimed authority to do so. I guess that supports your position but you have to use a corrupt test to do so. Many even rip through John 1:1 Some supporting my position and some supporting yours but without any authority to do so. I would leave it as it was in the TR and how it was finished in the king James. In the Beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. Ephesians 3:9 in many of today's bibles takes away any role that Jesus had in the Creation. Again without any authority at all. This goes on through out the Bible Matthew 18:11 is simply removed in the body of many bibles. Missing from many bibles you can start at Matthew such as Matthew 5:44, Matthew 6:13, Matthew 6:33, Matthew 8:29, Matthew 9:13. leaves out "to repentance." So what are they called to?, Matthew 9:18, Matthew 13:51, Matthew 16:20, Matthew 17:21, Matthew 18:11 Whole verse just as many of the others. Gone. and it says "For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost." This was His purpose in coming to this Earth in the first place., Matthew 20:20, Matthew 23:14, Matthew 25:13, Mark 1:14, Mark 2:17 This is a lot like Matthew 9:13. Seems some people do not like being called to repentance., Mark 5;6, Mark 7:16,, Mark 9:24, Mark 9:44, Mark 9:46, Mark 11:10, Mark 11:26, Mark 15:28, Mark 16:9-20 as I mentioned above, Luke 4:8, Luke 4:41, Luke 7:31, Luke 11:2, Luke 11:4, Luke 17:36, Luke 22:43, Luke 22:44, Luke 23:17, Luke 23:42, John 5:4. Acts 2:30, Acts 8:37, Romans 14:10, Entire verse taken out, Romans 16:24, Galatians 5:17 here they do not mind calling Jesus their Saviour but they draw the line at here calling him lord. They want him as Fire insurance but they do not want to DO as He says."We do not want to "work" our way to Heaven." You are not Working your way to Heaven.Jesus did that for you. But your reward is based on your work. (1 Corinthians 3:8), Ephesians 3:14, Colossians 1:2, 1 Timothy 2:7, 2 Timothy 4:22, Hebrews 2:7, 1 John 5:13, Many in Revelation 1:11 leaves out that Jesus is both and says that "I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last." Revelation 5:14 many leave out "… and the elders fell down and worshipped." Many say like the NIV, "Him that liveth for ever and ever." Who were the elders worshipping? The lamb who was slain, the one who said in Revelation 2:8 "These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive."
        This continues all through the bibles To much to put down and talk about in a short note such as this. The Gospels, the book of Acts and the letters of Paul through the letters of John to Revelation. Us Latter Day Saints of the Church of Jesus Christ are picked on for adding to Scripture and taking away which I would say God has added much more then He has taken away.
        The bibles of today have done a greater damage to the Bible then You have accused us of doing. Yet you readily use any book that has the words "Holy Bible" or even some that do not even come close to this description. Your professors who compile these bibles for you do not even believe in the divine origin of much of the content if even at all. Yet you throw rocks at us. "People who live in glass houses . . . "
        Study these verses that I have listed with per-versions like the NIV with more complete and accurate versions like the King James which is the best out there and see that the Christian Church as a whole has been the biggest perverter of the words of God.
      - Mex Seiko
        
        You're digging your hole deeper and deeper. You're not simply deceived, you're studiously deceived. The Mormon church has educated you with carefully prepared courses on how to systematically discredit the Word of God while indoctrinating into believing that you are a Christian. I tell you like I tell the Jehovah's Witnesses. None of the Apostles were Jehova's Witnesses or Mormons or Muslims. Jesus was neither.
        You can't even pretend entering the Kingdom of God by following the prescription to enter the kingdom of Mormon. Matt 7:23 is a warning against "Christians" who present "credentials" to Jesus based on works. It'll be sad to watch you show Him the book of Mormon as your ticket.
        Again, both the book of Mormon and Qur'an are plagiarized counterfeits of the real Word of God and their sole purpose is to deceive, take souls away from, and as you attempted, discredit the Truth. Even Catholicism, which developed from within earlier Christianity but became corrupt and stifled the independent study of the Bible in order to be able to insert their false doctrines with impunity or question.
        The message and truth of God is clear. Look to Jesus' redemptive sacrifice at the cross for your sins. Accept Him as your Lord and Savior, repenting from all your sins and be saved.
        Edgardo.
      - petroskhan
        
        You want to really watch him avoid giving you a straight answer? Ask him if God was once a man like us. Their so-called "prophet" Joseph Smith said it numerous times, as did Brigham Young and others.
      - Mex Seiko
        
        The Bible says the mind is deceitful above all things. Literally looking at this passage and actually "talking" to it is absolutely amazing. These man is actually an apologist for such an indefensible counterfeit, and he is absolutely convinced. He is deceived from without and within. God help him.
        Edgardo.
      - petroskhan
        
        I agree. They hold fast to something so obviously flawed, and then try to tell you you're missing something…
        
        And if you've noticed my exchanges with them, they steadfastly refuse to answer a single question regarding their faith's principles. I think they know, deep down, that they have no answers, but just want you to follow them, since that might prove they're right.
      - Mex Seiko
        
        God in His infinite wisdom had the Old Testament translated in the universal language of Greek, and His Testimony by the Apostles also written in the universal language in an era God carefully selected and deemed "The Appointed Time." Greek is well known and still used today. The nonsense of the "different versions" or "lost in translation" argument is tired and bogus. Too bad you catastrophically wasted so much time at this.
        Romans 1 provides a sort of dispensation and judgment to those who would not receive the benefit of the Scriptures saying that God is revealed by the things made (Created). He will judge. You will have to answer for your intentional efforts to discredit God's Word with the aim to deceive others as well as yourself.
        The message is clear and the testimony of God is true. Books that come and go from and to nowhere like the book of Mormon are mysterious and obscure. The Bible is sufficient and in need of no other explanatory or contradicting deflection of its true nature of His Son, Jesus Christ.
        Mex.
      - Evermyrtle
        
        Do you believe that, JESUS CHRIST IS THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD????
      - Johnny Rudick
        
        Yes. The Scriptures teach us that Jesus Is the only one born on this Earth who had a human mother and God the Eternal as His Father.
        Jesus is truly unique to say the least.
        
        The Greek word monogenes was not used in a literal sense, but meant one of a kind, or dearly beloved.
        "Begotten", in the sense of fertilization of an egg or placement of a fertilized egg into the womb.
        
        "Only", to signify that the miracle will not be preformed again; no one can claim to be begotten of the seed of God.
        I'd saying, "only" as in "unique".
        
        We are all the children of God begotten of His Spirit, not of His flesh.
        
        In the resurrection we will be His children in the flesh united in Spirit.
        
        LDS doctrine makes a distinction between our "flesh and blood" form in mortality and our "flesh and bone" form in eternity.
        
        Just as Jesus appeared to His Apostles after his resurrection.
        
        Luke 24:36 And as they thus spake, Jesus himself stood in the
        midst of them, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you.
        
        Luke 24:37 But they were terrified and affrighted, and supposed
        that they had seen a spirit.
        
        Luke 24:38 And he said unto them, Why are ye troubled? and why
        do thoughts arise in your hearts?
        
        Luke 24:39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself:
        handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye
        see me have.
        
        Luke 24:40 And when he had thus spoken, he shewed them his
        hands and his feet.
        
        Luke 24:41 And while they yet believed not for joy, and
        wondered, he said unto them, Have ye here any meat?
        
        Luke 24:42 And they gave him a piece of a broiled fish, and of
        an honeycomb.
        
        Luke 24:43 And he took it, and did eat before them.
      - Johnny Rudick
        
        This is what I believe (as most Christian churches do) the Bible to be the Word of God as far as it is translated correctly.
        "μονο" means "only," "one," and "γενῆ" means "kind." There is no one or thing like Jesus. The phrase "only begotten" is misleading nowadays because we think it implies "having kids." I was used more generally to describe uniqueness.
        Jesus is the only one born on this earth that has an earthly mother and God as His Father. Jesus being uniquely man and God. The only begotten of the Father.
        
        More importantly I know that this same Jesus suffered and died to bring me back into the home of my Father in Heaven. Because of Him and what he willingly did.
      - Bar-Eliam
        
        Don't believe one word of this lying mormon. He won't answer your questions and worships another god. It is not the same Triune God you worship or am I supposing too much.
        These people believe that their versions of jesus has a brother and he is satan.
        This is a very brainwashed group…beware they go about like a roaring lion seeking those whom they may consume…satans work.
      - Johnny Rudick
        
        I would say "ye do error,not knowing the Scriptures."
        The Jesus you worship, if different from mine, is because you do not 'Rightly divide the word of Truth".
        
        Ignore the false teachings you have grown up with and
        "Come out from among them" and read those verses again which do cause you to "stumble at the Word."
      - evermyrtle
        
        Only BEGOTTEN SON IS THE ONLY TRUE WAY THAT HE CAN BE DESCRIBED, PROPERLY!! It is only misleading to the ignorant, anti-GOD element.
      - Evermyrtle
        
        Not unless they believe HE is the "ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD" I do not know what they believe about this fact, they will not tell you. They will come at you with something else every time you ask one of them how they stand on this. They WILL NOT TELL YOU!!
    - John Adams
      
      Mormons believe that Satan and Jesus Christ are brothers. Mormons are NOT Christians!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
      - Esther
        
        Mr Adams, I suppose you are Christian. If so, please answer if you will, who made you?
      - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100004047180339 John Adams
        
        Jesus Christ is the Creator.
      - Esther
        
        I learned as a born and bred Catholic that God made me. How is that wrong?
    - Chris
      
      The Book of Mormon is pure fiction – please get a clue. Mitt Romney sucks as a human being – you just prefer white people who are religious.
  - http://profile.yahoo.com/HFMELPJ2QU37W53K2TKL4HJQGM Ted
    
    That's true. But the question still stands: "Which would you rather have..?"
    - guest
      
      The Mormon who was a pastor and a missionary!
  - mesaman
    
    People are down on what they aren't up on. In your case, you don't have a clue what you are talking about.
    - Bret Stiles
      
      You aren't up on what I know.
      - mesaman
        
        That may be, but as a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints and I challenge you to tell me what you think you know. Then I can clear up any fantasies or myths you may be alluding to.
      - Esther
        
        NOT
      - Esther
        
        I bet I am.
    - Esther
      
      Bret Stiles likely is one of those Calvinist-types who thinks work is a demeaning activity. He likely also believes in imputation which makes him totally useless in a society where the individual must take responsibility, be accountable and work hard. here is the kind of thing caused by Calvinists: QUOTE:
      
      On October 27, 1553 John Calvin, the founder of Calvinism, had Michael Servetus, the Spanish physician, burned at the stake just outside of Geneva for his doctrinal beliefs!(1) Hence, the originator of the popular doctrine of "once saved, always saved" (known in certain circles as "the perseverance of the saints") violated the cry of the Reformation — "Sola Scriptura" — by murdering a doctrinal heretic without Scriptural justification. This event was something John Calvin had considered long before Michael Servetus was even captured, for John Calvin wrote his friend, Farel, on February 13, 1546 (seven years prior to Michael Servetus' arrest) and went on record as saying:
      "If he [Servetus] comes [to Geneva], I shall never let him go out alive if my authority has weight."(2)Evidently, in that day John Calvin's authority in Geneva, Switzerland had ultimate "weight." This is why some referred to Geneva as the "Rome of Protestantism"(3) and to John Calvin as the "Protestant 'Pope' of Geneva."(4)
      During Servetus' trial, John Calvin wrote:
      "I hope that the verdict will call for the death penalty."(5)
      
      READ MORE AT http://www.evangelicaloutreach.org/michael-servetus.htm
  - Esther Mae Egan
    
    Correct, There is only one way to heaven, though the blood of Jesus Christ. Narrow is the way that leads to heaven and few there be that find it. Broad is the way to destruction and many are on that way. Mormons do not believe in Jesus. They may give Him lip service, but they follow many gods. In fact, they think they are gods. God is not going to share His throne with any one.
    - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
      
      Mormons DO believe in Jesus; your "knowledge" is limted to the false teachings of someone. You have no idea what Mormons REALLY believe. We do NOT follow "many gods" We believe in God, the Eternal Father, His Son, Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost. These are biblical teachings, not proclamations of a council hundereds of years ago.
      - rebart
        
        Does this agree with your teachings of Chrisitanity:
        Let us make man in OUR image. Gen. 1:26
        the Son can do nothing ….but what he seeth the Father do. John5:19
        my Father is greater than I. John 14:28
        That they all may be one, as thou, Father, art in me. John 17:21
        …saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing on the right hand of God. Acts 7:55
        
        You, see, the LDS Church believes this, and much, much more FROM THE BIBLE, not from a ruler's mandate in the Middle Ages.
        
        And we also believe in this one: Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods? John 10:34
        And I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High. Psalm 82:6
      - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
        
        Your point? I am LDS, I know what we teach and what we believe, and yes, all those verses have come across my lesson manual as an Adult Sunday School teacher.
      - mallen11
        
        Making man in Our image speaks of the triune God — God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit — it was the creating of man's soul not his human body.
        When the Lord Jesus Christ was here on earth He spoke from His humanity in regards to God the Father, He was God incarnate, the revealed person of the Trinity.
        John 10:30 “I and the Father are one.”
        Phil 2:7 …He deprived Himself of the proper function of Deity, taking the form of a bond-servant, when He had been born in the likeness of mankind. (The perfect God became a servant so that we can have eternal life.)
        Phil 2:5-11 Have this attitude in yourselves which was also in Christ Jesus, who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped, but emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men. Being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross. For this reason also, God highly exalted Him, and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name, so that at the name of Jesus EVERY KNEE WILL BOW, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
        Phil 2:5-11 Have this attitude in yourselves which was also in Christ Jesus, who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped, but emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men. Being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross. For this reason also, God highly exalted Him, and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name, so that at the name of Jesus EVERY KNEE WILL BOW, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
        John 10:34 and Ps 82:6 are not speaking of God the Father, Son or Holy Spirit but of idol type gods.
        I Tim 6:15-16 which He will bring about at the proper time—He who is the blessed and only Sovereign, the King of kings and Lord of lords, who alone possesses immortality and dwells in unapproachable light, whom no man has seen or can see. To Him be honor and eternal dominion! Amen.
        There will be NO other gods in heaven — only God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit who are the one in essence.
      - A B Blair
        
        Do not Mormons believe that their God used to be a man as they are and grew up on another planet serving the God of that world or planet and was promoted to be the God of this world? Do not the Mormons also believe that Jesus and the devil are brothers born to God and one of his wives in Heaven?
      - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
        
        This article isn't about doctrine, but the ability to overcome prejudice and vote for a man who is far superior to the current occupant of the White House. If you want to discuss theology, find me on Facebook.
      - Poorman
        
        Jeannetta – I have no problem with voting for a Mormon, esp vs a Muslim (he said he was on one taped meeting). However, when the pair of guys come to my door to peddle Mormonism, we have a divider at the beginning of any conversation. I know you believe in Jesus as the son of God (born) but please tell me that you believe that Jesus is "God the SON" and they cannot go with a belief in the Trinity of God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit (i.e. Gen 1:26 uni-plural "us" and I Jo 5:6-8). Jesus is the only way because he is the "Word" and the only way to heaven because he is God. I believe that the Mormon teaching is also that a person can obtain the same status as Jesus. I have heard also that Satan is the brother of Jesus, but I haven't investigated. I live in Mormon country and have had many discussions with them for many years. I have also read books from mormon leaders who left the church because of their teachings being in conflict with the Word of God.
        
        Check out Galatians 1:6-9 and tell me if you believe this applies to the angel Moroni? Isn't the book of Mormon "another gospel". Paul speaks to the Galatians with a warning about false teachers.
      - petroskhan
        
        Sure, you just believe that each one of you will become a god, rule your own planets, etc. And you actually believe that the Book of Mormon is more accurate than the Bible? There is a long list of contradictions between your so-called "Christianity" and true Christianity.
      - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
        
        We believe the Bible to be the word of God, as far as it is translated correctly; check out the long list of scholars who testify that the Bible HAS errors; the Book of Mormon is also the Word of God, and had corrected the transcribed errors.
        How does this have anything to do with voting for Romney?
      - petroskhan
        
        See my other comments for the answer to your question.
      - Pastor Dwayne
        
        Why///// then do we need a book of Mormon ??????
      - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
        
        The Book of Mormon is Another Testament of Jesus Christ. Maybe you should READ it before you discount it.
      - Pastor Dwayne
        
        And what makes you think I haven't??
      - Pastor Dwayne
        
        Since we already have the Bible we don't need "another testament"!!!!!
      - Evermyrtle
        
        Maybe like Jessie Jackson, they want to add another book to the Bible. It cannot be done.
      - Pastor Dwayne
        
        You would think people would get a clue, there is way to many Mormons coming out of Mormonism! They are taught that the Bible has been translated into half truths.
        I have a copy of the original Aramaic Peshitta Bible translated one time, not many times, into English! It is the most accurate version available.
        I am in the process of moving at the moment. When I get settled in in 2-4 weeks , I get into teachings of the Mormon church , and why you should run like crazy to get out of it!!!!!!!!!
      - Esther
        
        Pastor Dwayne: Your bible specifies the need for more than one witnesses.
      - Pastor Dwayne
        
        I wanted to puke after reading 1 page of the book of morman, my wife wanted to puke, my Bible college teacher, I quote , said after beginning to read the book of mormon , he wanted to go to the bathroom and puke.
        
        I call that a three fold witness!
        
        The book of mormon , like the koran, steals scripture out of the Bible to TRY to make their book real
      - Esther
        
        How unfortunate.
      - Pastor Dwayne
        
        No, that is what happens some times when The Holy Ghost does not witness with what a Christian hears or reads.
      - Esther
        
        Yes, it is unfortunate
      - Pastor Dwayne
        
        I'm surprised you haven't ask what page of the book of mormon I read??
      - Esther
        
        Why should that surprise you? I have never asked that question of anyone.
      - Esther
        
        Jeannetta, You are as Christian as they are, however, it will be a difficult path to take if you endeavor to convince just about anyone on the zionica site. I understand what you are saying. I prefer to be a member of the American Christian church of the Mormons more so than any Catholic church derivative, which is what all Protestants are, so I fully empathize.
      - Pastor Dwayne
        
        Esther , If you really knew the Word of God you would,t make the statement , "which is what all Protestants are"!!, In my studies / I made the statement , the Mormon religion is just a high order of the catholic church,
        The Devil's angel, moroni (sp?) did his job. according to Gal 1.:8 If we or an ANGEL preach "any" other Gospel. Mormons call it another Testement Of Jesus.
        Unfortunatley most mormons are born into mormonism. If a non-mormon gets Born Again reads and "STUDIES" the Bible . Then as I was on a walk at nite time I was given a book of mormon, I took it home read one page , got so sick I wanted to puke, I gave it to my wife, told her to read what I just read, she did and said I feel like puking . The next day was Bible college of which my class was beginning to study CULTS, Mormonism was the first we studied! The teacher said, and I quote, " when you "begin" to read the book of mormon you want to go to the bathroom and PUKE. Again, when you know the word of God you know that you know that we don't need another testament of Jesus Christ, which is according to Gal. 1:8 another Jesus! So does believing in "another Jesus" save you? answer , the devil can give that warm fuzzy feeling also, because satan is the author of another testament of Jesus!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
      - Pastor Dwayne
        
        With all that said There has been non- believers in office before so I would Certainly vote Mitt!!!
      - Pastor Dwayne
        
        With that said, Yes I will still vote for Mitt!
      - Esther
        
        Mitt will not disappoint any honest person in this country. He follows James 1:5 as all Mormons do.
      - Pastor Dwayne
        
        But following another Gospel, (To you, another Jesus) when you ask for wisdom, James 1:5, who are you going to get it from? Not the God of The one and only Word of God , the Bible.
        Sit down and think,,, Pauls warning in Gal 1: 8-9 if an angel teaches you any other word than that which he wrote, let him be accursed! I only know of two religions that angels approached a man, I can't prove it, but those two angels are the one and same moroni! NOW I know you don't think to much of the muslim religion, so once again, SIT DOWN AND THINK.
      - Esther
        
        Its when I read you, that I am confirmed that Mr. Jeff Dixon is right. Thanks to my great friends in the Mormon church, I have people who truly have a witness of the Holy Spirit, which moves me to acknowledge the presence of the three-in-one-purpose God, because people like you make me feel empty. Jeffrey doesn't believe in the biblical God. If there is a God, he will find him through reasonable ways. The God which he finds is more like the God of the physical universe which so reasonably follows physical laws. You are an outliar, Pastor Dwayne, no pun intended. I just made up a new word that fits you to a T. Sorry Sir, no disrespect to the species of Man intended.
      - Pastor Dwayne
        
        You sure don't get the witness of the Holy Ghost thru true Christians. apparently you did not SIT DOWN AND THINK, did you. God has always used MAN to advance his Gospel. But the Apostle Paul was told by the Spirit of God to look out for angels in Gal 1:8-9.
      - Bighoss
        
        James 1:5 is a crutch for Mormons who want to believe the tripe foisted on them by their false prophets.
      - Esther
        
        I think different… thanks to my goodly parents, little pony
      - Bighoss
        
        Then hobble along on that splintered crutch your parents provided. That way, you have no incentive to really examine your bizarre belief system.
      - Esther
        
        I love freedom and the Church of Jesus Christ of Letter-day Saints provides it more so than the Catholic Church or any of its spin-off Protestant sects. You are the one so deceived: there is so much fear about the "Mormons" that you, as others, have built an elaborate fascade of lies to intimidate and demean our faith. You hang your defense of those lies by what? By lambasting really good folks like my parents. How pathetic you and others on this forum are who have no basis whatsoever of doing so.
      - millergroup2
        
        Mary Wood. You are so full of BS. One day you are a Mormon…then Christian…..Then Theist….Then Atheist. What are you today? Hindu? You are a phoney, like the wanna-be avatar. Get real big woman.
      - Esther
        
        To the Millers: Dream on, pseudo-Christian
      - millergroup2
        
        You are constantly attacking people. Take some time within your post to educate, edify, debate. My post to you was to get you to feel what other people feel like when you bash them. Taking sides with God-Hating Jeff, shows that you cannot defend creation, or rather will not. Pick one of your religions and stick with it. You teach children Sunday school. Act like it.
      - Esther
        
        When you and your sympathizers on the Zionica forum build a wall against the real Church of Jesus Christ, it tells me everything I need to know about the intelligence present and its lack of reason (as Jeff Dixon has pointed out many times.) What is debate if the lack of reason is permitted to rule? My God is infinitely reasonable. He is not satanic. Satan is Satanic. The God of the pseudo-Christian is Satanic. If you or others can't see that, then there is nothing to debate. I have seen in the last few days the most egregious offences against God and that is a denial of the ability of the Holy Ghost to impart knowledge. Not one person has come forward to defend this point of view. So where are the real Christians? It is not obvious to me that there are any unless they can confirm this basic principle, confirmed time after time in the peoples of the Book of Mormon YES, I said it, the power of the Holy Spirit is confirmed time after time in the Book of Mormon by the people of the Church of Jesus Christ in the Americas.
      - Bighoss
        
        If I have lied about your cult, then you should be able to show just where and how I have lied. But you won't do that, since you can't. Thus you, like other Mormons, simply spout your pouty generic complaints that you are somehow being persecuted by false accusations. Why should it be so difficult for you to craft a sensible, substantive response to criticisms that you consider to be lies?
      - Esther
        
        We don't need to. You are self-inconsistent and unworthy of decent conversation with people of the Church of Jesus Christ or any reasonable people for that matter. You have shown this time and time again as any reasonable person can see in the record of this forum.
      - Bighoss
        
        All right, Esther. Let me ask you to respond to just ONE thing I have posted on Mormon doctrine and let's see if you can give an answer that actually addresses the subject. Here it is:
        
        "[The LDS Church] teaches that God had physical sexual intercourse with Mary in the same way that mortals have sexual intercourse and that Jesus was the product of that union."
        
        Now, is that or is not that not a doctrine of the LDS Church?
        
        Straight answer, please. Is that not a reasonable request?
      - Esther
        
        Read my previous communication to you and others sent to your colleague Petroskhan. You have my answer.
      - Bighoss
        
        Your previous communications do NOTHING to rebut contentions about your cult that I or other well-informed posters have submitted. You avoid the subject matter, relying instead on unsupported accusations that we are lying, or are pathetic, or dishonest in our criticism. But you don't put up the goods to support any of those charges, Esther. Denial is not rebuttal. That is something that Mormons seem to have great difficulty understanding.
      - Esther
        
        The more I hear you, the more I love Joseph Smith.
      - Bighoss
        
        The more I read of what you post as "responses," the more I am convinced that you are as impenetrably dense as depleted uranium.
      - Vladimir
        
        Esther, you post well, but Bighoss is a troll. He needs to be fed to keep disparaging the Lord's Church. Best not to feed the trolls. Like a bad case of poison ivy, if you don't scratch them, they dry up. I thoroughly vetted Petroskhan and he's another troll. They are easy to spot. Just let them starve.
      - Kronae
        
        Is it true? Is necromancy a big part of your belief system. Is sex with a long dead man satisfying?
      - Esther
        
        I love my parents also. What on Earth does that mean to a brain-dead man like yourself?
      - millergroup2
        
        Thank you Bighoss. No matter how much you try to turn these deceived cult lovers around, they will come back with uneducated gibberish that their cult teaches them to protect the lies. They will not research, nor will they rebut with an intelligent answer. They are not smart enough to study and teach their children truth. In my book that is child abuse. Time and time again we have proved from their own book of lies (the book of Mormon), that Jo Smith was nothing more than a crack head, that no Mormon prophesy has ever come true, and that their cult religion is headed up by Satan.
    - guest
      
      I guess with me it comes to this. Muslims behead and crucify those who refuse their religion. Never have heard anything from Mormons(Church of Christ of Latter Day Saints) except love. Can't say I know everything about them, but just taking into consideration all of the good in Romney's past would make you think he is the best there is available. Anyway, this is the first time I have ever heard anyone say Mormon's didn't believe in Jesus and I have known several.
    - Bonnie Bell
      
      Mormons…stop it…we belong to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.We are Latter Day Saints, or LDS..We know there is only one way to heaven and that is through Jesus Christ as our Savior…Got to our meeting houses you will find this to be true. We do NOT follow many gods, one, just one Jesus…just stop it….if we did I would know it. I've been a member for 25 years.
    - Esther
      
      NOT true.
    - Evermyrtle
      
      Esther Mae you re correct. Through THE BLOOD OF JESUS CHRIST THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD
  - l
    
    Bret, I posted below as well. You are correct in your statement. However, many Mormons are taught to call themselves Christian from an early age, and therefore are not aware of the differences between a true Christian religion and Mormonism.
    Mormons are awarded a "godship" if they've lived a good Mormon life, etc. They marry a god-mother and have babies to populate the planet that they've been also awarded for living their good life. In their opinion, JC is one of many "sons of god".
    HOWEVER, for a true Christian, JC is the ONE AND ONLY, UNIQUELY BORN SON of the ONE AND ONLY GOD. It is an absolute that to be a true Christian, one must accept and believe this.
    I will again state that I have no problem with Mormons, or with voting for one. Mormons are caring, gentle people for the most part. (They have to be, or they won't get a planet and that coveted godship later, but, nevertheless, they are good people on the whole.)
    - Vladimir
      
      Speaking as a Mormon, what you describe is foreign to me. But I'm glad you are politically astute.
      - Esther
        
        You are just too kind, Vladimir! But like I said….
    - Esther
      
      It is this kind of ranting that makes one want to leave the human race. Why not leave people in peace? Especially with a little bit of research, you could probably gain some real respect for a religious sect that is appealing now to hordes of discerning young adults who are beginning to see through the hypocrisy of those who claim to follow Christ but don't. The Mormons are those who sincerely see Christ as the best role model in a sometimes insane world and honestly follow his best examples.
  - Bonnie Bell
    
    Bret, Mormons are Christian. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints is the actual name of the "Mormon church" Mormon is a nickname because of the Book of Mormon. Mormon being a prophet who compiled the ancient scriptures into the book we read.The definition of Christian is to be a follower of Christ. To do the will of the Lord. To live the commandments. We are followers of Christ. we keep the commandments, we read the scriptures and apply them to daily life. Our church is one of the few churches to be named after Jesus Christ. He is my savior, not multiple gods, nor works will get me to heaven.
  - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
    
    So you don't believe Jesus when he says His Father sent him?
  - canucksam
    
    Mormons believe in Jesus the Lord and Son of God. They don't believe in the Holy Trinity. However that may be, I will take a Mormon over a Muslim who worships a god that instructs them to kill all infidels who do not convert to Islam. It's a no-brainer.
- Robert30
  
  There no evidence that Obama is a Muslim non at all. In fact he was a long time member of a Christian church.
  - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
    
    If Jeremiah Wright is a "Chrisitan", then Hitler was a Mary Poppins. "Black Liberation Theology" is not Christian, and if you agree that "G…D…America" is a great way for a Christian to preach, then you've shown yourself to be as ignorant as your comments.
  - http://profile.yahoo.com/HFMELPJ2QU37W53K2TKL4HJQGM Ted
    
    You can stand all day in the garage, and not become a car.
  - http://www.facebook.com/jerry.l.ogles Jerry Levon Ogles
    
    Really? He has repeatedly supported Muslim interests over Christian interests. He supports abortion up to delivery, and then, if the baby survives, go ahead and kill it. He is no Christian. He has quoted, broadly, the Quran – but not the Bible except derisively. If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, guess what – chances are it is a duck…er …muslim. I'd vote for a wild hindu before a Barak Hussein Obama!
  - MJ29
    
    Being a member of a Christain church does not make one a Christain. Has he accepted the Lord Jesus Christ as his Lord and savior….if so, where are his fruits?
  - justme
    
    Being a member of a church doesn't make you a Christian. And that church obviously didn't preach what I know of Christians to preach.
  - guest
    
    What about him cancelling the national day of prayer and replacing it with a Ramadan celebration, or that he was Muslim as a child, or that he bows to all Muslim heads, or that any terrorism having to do with Radical Islam is sugar coated and covered up. If it quacks like a duck and walks like a duck, it is probably a duck.
    - Bighoss
      
      What about all that? I'll tell you about all that. It is the raving of wing-nut ideologues who care not for the truth. That is what it is about.
      - Bar-Eliam
        
        It is about brainwashed people speaking out on subjects which they have no concept. They can't visualize what truth really is.
        They are famous for going to many countries seeking their converts. They pick the uneducated, lowest of the low and who have no understand of religion of any type.
        Do they then after having converting said persons that no matter how they protest they are not now nor ever have been a Muslim?
        One of the strangest behaviors is when you ask them a question right here online written in plain everyday English they NEVER give anyone a straight answer.
        That is truly the behavior of brainwashed and brain-dead followers of any cult.
  - canucksam
    
    Where have you been the last 4 years? Obama has said several times, on record, that he is a Muslim. Just Google" YouTube Obama admits being a Muslim" and more than a few different videos will be available. Sheesh!
  - Esther
    
    You mean the one belonging to the "minister" calling on "God to damn the USA?"
- http://twitter.com/KennDillon Silver Haired Saint
  
  Yes. Mormon is the correct answer, just in case you weren't sure.
Justme

Yes we can and will voe for a Morman, at least where I'm from!
- katie
  
  Yes, we can. I am a born again, spirit-filled, Christ-loving Christian….no denomination name… just CHRISTIAN. Would mr. romney be an aethist or any other non-Christ believer, I would
  be suffering worse than now. I believe the Lord intervened for those of us who hear Him so
  we could support someone else. Someone on another site said he would vote for a gecko.
  I couldn't, but I got 'his drift'.
  - Robert30
    
    Very sad to see that you as a Christian could vote for a man who trashes the real beliefs of Christians.
    It is easier to vote for an Obama whom we can control just as we have these past 3 and 3/4's years. Many of you think he has one all he wanted. Not true! He was stopped in his tracks by the conservatives.
    Voting for Romney would be a vote for the devil himself.
    - Sama
      
      You think we are controlling Barry Soetoro????? What in the world have you been drinking,sniffing or snorting?? No he hasn't done all he wanted, he isn't done destroying America yet. Thank God he was slowed down after the 2010 elections.
      Romney isn't out to convert the masses to his spiritual beliefs, only to live what he believes to the best of his abilities. Freedom OF religion and the free practice thereof, remember. He isn't imposing HIS beliefs into our textbooks and our history.
    - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
      
      Robert30, you are truly delusional.
    - canucksam
      
      Your mind is controlled by Obama and his left wing-nuts. We already have Satan in OUR house but not for much longer.
- Robert30
  
  That is very sad. No doubt you are one of them.
- http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
  
  Thank you! Common sense will rule the day!
Bret Stiles

Mormons don't even believe Jesus is God.
- http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
  
  We do, but our belief in Jesus Christ has NOTHING to do with leading a nation out of the grip of Communism–which is GODLESS.
  - Bret Stiles
    
    Mormons teach multiple gods, polytheism.
    - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
      
      And? Jesus Christ is the SON of God; that is from the Scriptures. We believe that is literal, not figurative. This has NOTHING to do with how Mitt Romney will get the economy going again, and begin to sweep Communism out of our government.
      - Bret Stiles
        
        Mar 10:18 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God.
        
        Was Jesus good? YES
      - Robert30
        
        It has everything to do with this economy. Communism is NOT the problem in this government. This economy is the problem and there is no way a person so wrapped up in his religion can serve two demanding masters.
      - Bighoss
        
        Yep, you heretics DO believe it is literal. You believe that Jesus was the product of physical sexual intercourse between God and the former virgin Mary. That belief contradicts scripture, but that never bothered your false prophets, who simply made up absurd stuff and propagated it upon their deluded and brainwashed flocks who ignorantly and naively soaked it up.
      - Bar-Eliam
        
        Please cite where we will find active communists in government? There are a couple who admit to a practice but not the variety you are thinking of.
        The names would be very nice for those of us who are so uninformed would be of great help.
  - Robert30
    
    It has much more than you recognize. Jesus Christ can destroy communism but the statement of belief can also be used to lead a nation to stray. This would become a mormon nation and no longer dedicated to CHRISTIAN principles.
- Robert30
  
  Bravo for your insight and the strength to stand up and make a viable statement about this cult.
- G. Macher
  
  Nothing is worse than a Muslim. Not even a Nazi. At least Nazis believed in the equality of women. So long as they were Germanic women!
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes

Considering Mormon's are ALSO Christian's, I cannot think of one reason to NOT vote for a morally honest and decent man, aside from ignorance and bigotry.
- Jeffrey Hardin
  
  Mormons are not Christians…You best brush up on their theology. Nothing in their teachings can be compared to Christianity especially their belief that Yeshua is the brother of Satan, that YHVH is a man…That you earn your way to heaven instead of by grace. NO, they are a cult, not Christian!!!!
  Joseph Smith was jacked up on booze or Poppy and hallucinated that he spoke to the Arch Angel Michael, where he received the Mormon gospel, and he took from the from the Qur'an and from stripping down scripture from the Holy Bible, YHVHs living word, which all of it's self is blasphemy, you cannot take from nor add to YHVHs living word and use it to mislead others as the Church of Latter Day Saints does…
  There's but few Southern Baptist on the bible belt here who will not betray their faith, I am one of the very many who will vote for him…The South made that clear during the primary..Romney will win regardless because he's a Liberal and and the blacks will come out and vote for Romney…
  - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
    
    I AM a Latter-day Saint; unless you've attended our church, and have studied our theology, you have no right or reason to claim otherwise. If you are getting your information from a pastor or other anti-Mormon bigot, I suggest you change your church and your friends.
  - Robert30
    
    There are a LOT of fellow Baptists who will be voting against Romney as a protest if nothing more. He is founded and funded by one of the most evil cults in this world.
    - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
      
      Again, hyperbole and ad hominem attacks will not save our country; voting for Romney will at least get it out of the hands of a Communist.
- Robert30
  
  It isn't bigotry to point out the evil and cultish nature of the church and this particular man.
  They have a very ragged history when it comes to the truth of why his father was born in Mexico. Check it out.
  - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
    
    It is very bigoted and also ignorant to make claims that are false in order to smear someone you may disagree with; ad hominem attacks will not save this country from communism. Look up Webster's definition of "cult" and you will find that ALL churches are considered cults by the definition. I know exactly why his father was born in Mexico, it has nothing to do with the man running for office.
- Jasmine
  
  Amen, Jeannetta
antiliberalcryptonite

Yes. When presented with the choice of a mormon or a muslim…the choice is an easy one.
- Robert30
  
  We do not believe Obama is a Muslim. It seems more that he shows respect for other religions.
  Perhaps he does so not in a way we would find comfort but one that works for him.
  Most people don't know that his mother-in-law and wife take the kids to a local Baptist church in DC when in residence. He typically goes to the Washington Cathedral near the Whitehouse where presidents have worshiped for ages. No you don't hear much about that.
  Think about it Reagan, Johnson, Bush etc., did not attend church stating they did not want to cause a disruption. Carter did attend and teach in the local Baptist church and Nixon attended Quaker meetings when in his hometown.
  It is your choice to make but the LDS church is likened to an octopus with its many arms in much of the government as it is. Don't let them take away our religious freedoms.
  Check what has happened just in Utah where people who are not mormon can't work, live in decent housing etc.
  Few non-mormons move there and stay more than one year in any city.
  - meg903
    
    Meg-
    Robert, you are the worse nut case yet, for commenting. You just told the biggest lies ever. Utah has a BIG number of people living there that are not Mormons, and if they want a job, they can have one. The Mormons settled Utah. When they first arrived there it was nothing but a desert. They made it blossom like a rose, and have made it what is is. I know a lot about that state. Evidently you are spouting lies you have heard, because what you have posted are BIG lies. If the Mormons run the state, they are the ones that can do it, and they do a good job. So get your facts straight before posting again. I know a lot of people besides Mormons that live there, and love it.
    - Robert30
      
      And I know a large number of real Christians who have gone there and left within a year due to the hostility of this state toward non-morons.
      These are professionals such as doctors, lawyers not just common laborers looking for a job.
      - meg903
        
        Meg- Well, Robert, when were you given the authority to judge who is a Christian or who isn't? Regardless of your view point, I know as well as you think you know who is or isn't a Christian, that the members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints are Christians. Whether you or others like you think so, does not make your thinking true. So spend your time judging whether God knows you are a Christian, and the " Mormons " will take care of themselves. They have been doing a great job for over 150 years, and so far it has worked wonderful.
  - MJ29
    
    Be informed…..Obama stated he was a Muslim.
    - Robert30
      
      President Obama has NEVER stated he is a Muslim. Please post your resource so when you don't we will all know how stupid you are.
  - Johnny
    
    My familly moved to Utah 38 years ago, and I am still here, having worked at a good job for more that 30 of those years–and I have not yielded to the misinterpretations of Scripture that abound in the Latter Day Saints' system of belief. I hold to Jesus Christ alone, not trusting in my own works at all for salvation.
  - Mitch Sagraves
    
    Robert30….you said O shows respect for other religions…..hmmm, is that why he's making folks that have a religion that goes against birth control & abortion, that they'll be fined if they don't help pay for out?!?! Do us a favor & get your head out of your anal orifice…you might see more clearly!
    - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
      
      No, only why he bows to everyone.
Eileen37

The more important question is can a christian vote for a muslim. Muslims are the sworn enemies of God's chosen children and they kill their own people if the convert to christianity. I think a mormon would be preferable to what we have now.
- Robert30
  
  You would not make that choice if you really new where the mormons want to take you and your money.
  - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
    
    That is nothing more than hyperbole.
  - G. Macher
    
    Muslims are commanded to kill us or make up pay protection money. You'd better read the Koran.
  - canucksam
    
    Not NEW – it's Knew, Mr. I've Read Alinsky.
David

Actually the choice is at MORON vs a Mormon.
- Robert30
  
  I would chose the moron as one can control them and the mormons want to control you and get your 10% joseph smith tithe.
  - mesaman
    
    You aren't any smarter here than you were later.
  - BohdanUke1
    
    Get a life while learning how to spell. Moron.
    - Robert30
      
      My spelling is just fine. Obviously you just don't understan English.
      Take your crap and go elsewhere.
      - rebart
        
        Sounds just like a member of the party that has been taken over by the hateful, despicable Left.
  - Suz
    
    It’s called tithing in the Bible. Look to yourself – do you tithe? If you do, then complain. If you don’t, be quiet. O is not a moron, irrespective of what has been written. He is a conniving, leftwing socialist who speaks well and says what he thinks will get him re-elected but, as we have seen in the previous 4 years, will do exactly the opposite if he gets back in. He has been trained well by Marxists and Communists. Read Saul Alinsky’s “Rules for Radicals” but be prepared for an individual who uses the Bible, the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution to support his revolutionary position. (Suggestion: remove sharp objects or breakables when reading. Alinsky is already dead and should be roasting in hell.) Obama has spent millions sealing all his records so no one can see where he came from. (I intend to see the movie “2016” as soon as I can.) The lamestream media and the DNC did a really poor vetting process in 2007.
    - Robert30
      
      Obama has not spent millions sealing his records. Check it out online. You can read anything you want from his college transcripts etc. All of you have been told to read them but you are too lazy to search for them.
      I have read and studied Dr. Alinsky as have many in college as both grads and undergrads. Do you want to be exposed to only one philosophy because the one you accept is so weak as to be worthless. Reminds me of the religious folk who
      refuse to take a class in religions of mankind for fear their beliefs will be undermined.
      No guts. Do you know who wrote and directed 2016? You should check the authors out and find out what frauds they are. You and you kind are really being made fools of. You must truly like it such as your leader said about abortions, just lay back and enjoy it.
      - rebart
        
        Yes, and to add to that, we've had such great success under Obama's leadership. Jobs, security, economic growth, decrease in debt, building a fine military. Wait, that was Reagan, wasn't it?
      - canucksam
        
        That must be some crystal ball you looked into. His records are sealed and there's no way anyone can read them unless he authorizes it. And yes I have searched on the internet, and thoroughly. No, I for one will not read anything by that commie Alinsky. His teachings are part of the fabric Obama is using to tear this country apart and what have been used to brainwash you people. Last but not least, did you read Dreams From My Father? Now that was written by one heck of a fraud.
      - petroskhan
        
        You're not just a liar, you're a bad one.
        
        Obama has spent somewhere between 2 and 4 million dollars fighting to keep every record of his life sealed. Every record. From his birth, to his elementary school records, passport records, his college applications, his thesis, his records as a senator, his client list as an attorney…EVERYTHING.
        
        Hell, you can't even be reasonably sure that you're voting for Barack Obama. There is no way to tell who this man really is. Believe what you want, just don't ask me to sample the Kool Aid you're quaffing with such enthusiasm.
      - Esther
        
        You get a thumbs up on the politics.
      - petroskhan
        
        Well, I'm not ALL bad…
      - Esther
        
        100% on your Mormon outlook!
      - Bighoss
        
        Bullfeathers!
      - petroskhan
        
        Chickenteeth!
  - guest
    
    Then why hasn't anybody been able to control this one. He is just waiting for this 2nd election to become the dictator. Even stated in a foreign speech about his desire to be the dictator or king, whichever you prefer.
Bob Williams

How about a politically conservative Mormon and theologically liberal Muslim? The Christian stuff by Obama is just a ruse.
- http://profile.yahoo.com/HFMELPJ2QU37W53K2TKL4HJQGM Ted
  
  He's no more a Christian than my dog.
  - jimmy john
    
    you are so right muslims are like DOGS
    - canucksam
      
      No, they like to EAT them!
  - Patriot
    
    Actually, I believed my dog was a Christian because when I was very young, I had baptized her .
    - Evermyrtle
      
      A dog is the best friend you can have, so don't dare put him a such level of Muslin Islamists.
- AIRS
  
  For those of you who think that Obama IS a Christian you
  should look into and read about the pastor of the church that Obama went to.
  From what I know it was a anti-white group meeting that CALLED themselves
  Christian and preached hate.
  
  You should also read about the Black Muslim movement in America. I am a retired
  police officer and know a great deal about the Muslim movement among the
  blacks. Most have had very little to do with true Muslims, according to the
  Middle East standards. However, some are in fact Muslim but not most. The Black
  Muslims basically established a NEW religion called 'Muslim' but with many
  other objectives. The Zebra murders in San Francisco was by a group who called
  themselves Black Muslims!
  
  When I told a friend that Obama was a Muslim he said,
  "That's is impossible. Muslims would never set foot in a Christian
  Church!" THAT is assuming that the place Obama went to, that was CALLED a
  Christian church, led by Wright was in fact Christian!! Based on the HATE he
  preached and the FRUIT that they produced it was NOT Christian. Mat. 12:33,
  Luke 6:43-45
  - Robert30
    
    The Christian Church that was guided until recently when he retired is a true Christian Church. It is far from a 'black' church as there are many white people who attend regularly. One of its better known members is Oprah. Hardly a rip roaring Muslim.
    By the way perhaps you are not aware that Dr. Jeremiah Wright graduated from one of the best Christian Seminaries in this nation and is a retired, much decorated Marine.
    You would not dare make these comments to his face.
    - Steve Spence
      
      LOL. You missed the boat on this post. There is nothing Christian about this church.
      - Evermyrtle
        
        No Christian Church would allow Oprah any authority in it. She is the opposite of a Christian and teaches false ideas, ideas opposed to GOD'S WORD.She does not believe that we are saved by the BLOOD OF JESUS CHRIST, which is what makes you a Christian.
    - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
      
      Again, Robert30 letting his ignorance show.
    - petroskhan
      
      I would dare to say whatever I wanted to his face. He is NOT a Christian, and he is not a patriot. The man is a puffed up, publicity seeking blow hard, who should be ignored.
      
      Sort of like your comment.
      - http://twitter.com/KennDillon Silver Haired Saint
        
        amen
    - Gordon
      
      Everything else aside, Rev. Wright's current marriage began while he was counseling a couple with marital problems. He seduced the woman and broke up the marriage and then having stolen another man;s wife, married her. I don't know how many marriages Rev. Wright has been through, but according to Jesus and the Apostle Paul, the marriage covenant ends at the death of one of the partners and to marry another while the other partner is alive constitutes a state of adultery…so, do the math!
    - canucksam
      
      If he, in fact, is a retired Marine he sure didn't preach like a Marine who loves his country. He may have graduated from one of the best Seminaries but then, Obama graduated from Columbia and Harvard and he's not the brightest bulb in the socket. He also lacks class and is determined to destroy this country. Both of them may be nice people – on the surface. But, who can tell what they're really like on the inside?
      - http://twitter.com/KennDillon Silver Haired Saint
        
        God.
    - LouiseCA
      
      Oh, I bet we would.
      - jamie browim
        
        I will bet you would get your buck teeth shoved in your fat face.
    - Esther
      
      No WORTHY marine would make such a statement as he made, and then from a pulpit in an American church! How are we supposed to take such comments? I don't care where you "graduated from" nor how "decorated" you are. He totally lost credibility when he made that statement. And Obama did not distance himself from the man until years later when it became known in the political arena. Notice he [Obama] was quiet about it, said nothing about it until he just snubbed the minister's wishes to visit the WH, and it was the minister who whined about Rham Emmanuel… remember that. If nothing else Obama knows how to make others the fall guy for his indiscretions.
    - Laird
      
      The United Church of Christ does not believe in the Deity of Jesus Christ, nor in the virgin birth, nor Hell, nor in the inerrancy of the Bible! They believe in a gutted Christianity that only serves left-wing social causes and NOT God!
    - http://twitter.com/KennDillon Silver Haired Saint
      
      Just because one is a former Marine that "graduated from one of the best," unnamed, "Christian Seminaries" does not mean he is a Christian. I have heard the hate he spews and that is not Bible, that is not God's word.
      
      I just read this article from the ICR which talks about false teachers and it seems appropriate here.
      
      The Institute for Creation
      Research webmaster@my.icr.org
      
      Preaching against False
      Teachers
      
      September 4, 2012
      
      ""But whoso shall offend one of
      these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a
      millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the
      depth of the sea." (Matthew
      18:6)
      
      Jude, an earthly brother of our Lord,
      had become a leader in the early church by the time he wrote his
      epistle. He had intended "to write unto you of the common
      salvation," but instead was compelled by God's Spirit to write
      and "exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith"
      (Jude 3)
      against the onslaught of false teachers. He writes "to convince
      all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they
      have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly
      sinners have spoken against him" (Jude
      15).
      
      Few categories of people are so
      summarily denounced in Scripture as false teachers, those who teach
      error from within. Nearly every biblical writer echoes God's hatred
      of them and their work. Here, Jude refers to Enoch's ancient teaching
      to demonstrate the fact that God has always hated false teachers and
      has warned them of their doom. Unfortunately, many of today's pulpits
      and "Christian" airwaves are filled with false teachers and
      their teaching, leading many astray.
      
      But this is also a lesson to be learned
      by any who would teach, even born-again, God-gifted teachers. Error
      is a serious thing in God's eyes, and a Bible teacher must
      continually submit to God's Word and Spirit to discern and teach only
      truth. Evidently it would be better for those teachers, seminarians,
      and others who espouse errors such as humanism, evolution, and other
      false concepts, that a millstone were hung about their necks and that
      they drowned in the depth of the sea than to lead astray those
      "little ones" in their influence."
      
      JDM
David S.

In this country you can vote for whomever you want to. This is why I cannot, in good faith, vote for either Romney or Obama. Ron Paul 2012. To each their own.
- merriel
  
  David S.
  You might just as well punch the button for another 4 yrs of Obama. No vote or a vote for a third party is a vote for Obama!!! Please reconsider.
  - Bret Stiles
    
    If Romney loses, then maybe that will awaken Republicans to vote for an actual conservative.
    - merriel
      
      Bret!
      By that time it will be too late! We will have another 4 yrs of Obama and we can kiss our GREAT COUNTRY a fond farewell!!
      - Bret Stiles
        
        we've already lost our country. It's called the income tax, socialist security numbers, registration at birth, I-9, legal tender, compulsory education in government schools ect.. ect.. ect..
      - merriel
        
        We have lost some of our country, but we can win it back with the right man in our White House. The man ( I use the term loosely) in our Oval Office is not the right man. I firmly believe that he became president to bring our country down. When he was sworn into office, he vowed to protect and defend the Constitution and he is destroying it.
- GWjr
  
  Obama and the Dems thank you, David S.
http://www.missiontoisrael.org/ Ted R. Weiland

"Lay hands suddenly on no man, neither be partaker of other men's sins: keep thyself pure." (1 Timothy 5:22)

"For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist. Look to yourselves, that we lose not those things which we have wrought, but that we receive a full reward. Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son. If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your [personal, State, White, Senate or] house [of Representatives] neither bid him God speed: For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds." (2 John 1:7-11)
http://www.facebook.com/people/June-Gagnon/1673686634 June Gagnon

Yes, Christian CAN vote for a Mormon – -a lot faster and easier than we can, or will vote for a muslim!
- Robert30
  
  Obama is NOT a muslim. He is a baptized Christian too bad you can't accept that fact.
http://www.missiontoisrael.org/ Ted R. Weiland

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6CtTP1s8BYk
librtyship

Obama a Christian???? This is a gross insult to all Christians. If you cannot spot an Islamic you are indeed in trouble! Obama kowtows to Islam every chance he gets!!! Where have you been??? Obviously not on planet Earth!!!
- Robert30
  
  Post evidence verifying your statements! You can't, as you are just lying.
  - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
    
    This is like asking God for a sign; if you can't see the evidences before you, it would be a colossal waste of time to point them out.
Gordon

Obama is a profoundly amoral political machine whose "Christianity" is a calculated tool to enable his quest for power. Inculcated in Islam, he is more a Muslim than anything else, religiously speaking.
His press and posturing is a study in deception and I encourage everyone to go and see, "2016, Obama's America" at a cinema near you.
Romney, by contrast exemplifies values held dear by Christians and American patriots. Your choice is between a Mormon and a Muslim, a Muslim who is showing himself to be a Marxist!
morefandave

I'm a Christian and know little about the tenets of the Mormon faith. However, I do know quite a bit about how that faith has motivated Romney to behave. He has saved businesses and jobs of people in them, saved the Salt Lake City Olympics, donated a LOT to charitable causes, and been totally upright in his personal life. Is there any likelihood that, as President, he would behave any differently? For me, there is no question at all and I can't see how anyone would have one.
- http://www.facebook.com/people/Stephen-Johnson/100000824645514 Stephen Johnson
  
  morefandave, just remember what it states in the King James Bible in Revelation 22:18-19 about the Book of the "m"ormons" and it is your answer:
  "For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are writtenin this book."
  Therefore, the Book of the "m"ormons" has nothing to do with the Word of God.
  - Robert30
    
    The Book of Mormon is a book of heresies! Anyone following these so-called tenets will reside for all eternity in the fires of hell.
    Sorry I won't sell out Jesus Christ!
    - Vladimir
      
      Robert30, you obviously haven't read the Book of Mormon. I have read it and it is definitely lacking in heresies.
    - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
      
      I read it twice each year, and I can promise you, there are no heresies in there.
      - Esther
        
        I do love the Book of Mormon stories. Though the wars are very treacherous and I often skip over some of the passages, there is always a good lesson and one must be careful not to miss it…
  - Vladimir
    
    Stephen Johnson, Revelation 22:18-19 refers to the Book of Revelation not the Bible as a whole. When John the Beloved wrote the Book of Revelation the Bible did not yet exist.
    - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
      
      There is a similar comment in at least two other places in the Bible; they meant THEIR book; the Bible as we know it wasn't even compliled until around the 4th century, so they weren't talking out THE book, only their own testimonies.
  - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
    
    Obviously you don't know your history. John was talking of HIS manuscript, the Bible wasn't complied into ONE book until roughly 400 A.D.; significantly after John's writing.
http://www.facebook.com/people/Stephen-Johnson/100000824645514 Stephen Johnson

The real question is do we have a choice. "m"ormonism is a satanic cult and so are the "free"masons; and anyone who knows the Bible knows good and well Obama is no Christian. So outside of that your only choice is not to vote. "The only" reason I'm voting for Mitt is to get the god of the DNC (TIME magazine: "He's almost a god") out of office.
Robert30

Christians are not to consort with the UNGODLY. Neither are we to mingle with cultist.
Any religion that states as its primary belief that Jesus Christ and Satan are brothers is one of the blackest cults around.
You are not to have any relationship with such cultists. There is far more in fact, so much more that could be listed about the cult that is so Anti-Christian but there is not enough room nor time.
I would rather vote for Obama than this man at least he will make no more to take over the schools and turn them into LDS institutions.
Stand strong and vote for the devil you know and can control rather than one whose whole life is dedicated to turning good and faithful Christians into mormons.
God help us ALL!
- GWjr
  
  Robert30 says (and has got to be kidding when he says it) "
  Stand strong and vote for the devil you know and can control…" What control did we have when Obama etal shoved ObamaCare down our throats? Or signs goofy Executive Orders whenever he feels like it?
  - Robert30
    
    The orders are not as you say goofy.
    He has NOT shoved the alternative medical health care program down your throat.
    99% of it has not been enacted and will never be enacted. You should have been around when Medicare was in force for the first time.
    Are you going to like having to figure out how you will replace Medicare with a couple of thousand dollars in vouchers? You will never be able to get the level of medical care you now have available to yourself or your parents.
    Basically you don't know what you are talking about.
    - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
      
      No Robert30, it is you who have no idea what you are talking about.
      - Vladimir
        
        I have to agree with you, Jeannetta Noble Stokes. Robert30 just spouts what he's heard and believed without any research. He's basically an anti-Mormon troll. How he got that burr under his saddle would be an interesting story.
joan

i NEVER THOUGHT i WOULD VOTE FOR A MORMON BUT I AM.
I AM VOTING FOR MITT ROMNEY BECAUSE HE IS THE BETTER OF THE TWO CHOICES.
OBAMA IS TRULY TRYING TO DESTROY AMERICA ….AND I NEVER BELIEVED HE WAS A CHRISTIAN…..OBAMA HAS A GREAT DISLIKE FOR THE FREEDOM AMERICA HAS….HE HAS A GREAT DISLIKE FOR GREAT MEN LIKE WINSTON CHURCHILL, OBAMA LOVES KILLING BABIES AND THINKS MARRIAGE IS NOT BETWEEN ONE MAN AND ONE WOMAN.
WHAT WE KNOW ABOUT THIS PRESIDENT IS SCARY AND WHAT WE DON'T KNOW IS EVEN SCARIER.
NOT TO MENTION THAT EVERYTHING OUT OF THIS MAN'S MOUTH IS A LIE!
HE IS A COMPULSIVE LIAR.
DON'T VOTE FOR SOCIALISM AMERICA!!!! VOTE FOR ROMNEY AND RYAN!
- Robert30
  
  You are so very wrong in accusations against Obama. You have no facts and yet facts abound for the vote to be cast against Romney.
  He is not only a cultist he is an extreme cultist.
  - canucksam
    
    You're pulling our legs, right? You have to be because no one could be that stupid.
Mark Brickey

When the writer's premise is that BHO is a "Christian", then there's a major issue right there. Watch the DNC convention – there will be inclinations toward Christian, Catholic or catholic, but the imams & muslims will be rampant…
I don't agree with Mormonism, but I'd much rather have a strong Mormon with good values & business acumen than ANY left-wing socialist that can't & won't follow Constitutional law & is obviously trying to destroy the country…
- Suz
  
  Although we may not like a candidate for one reason or another, we must respect him and feel that what he believes in his heart of hearts will work to right all the wrongs that have been perpetrated on Americans so far. I have more respect for someone who professes and exhibits a love of God, his fellow man and country like both Romney and Ryan (who, incidentally, practice their religion rather than give it lip service) than one we aren't even sure is an American or a Christian, and who has only the lamestream media for support. Christians have different ways of praying but they pray to God! I'll vote for Anybody But Obama!!!!! It is time to end the division and come together to vote for talented men, not a left wing, Alinsky Communistic liberal who has no respect for our country, our real history unpolluted by the progressives nor any respect for those who fought, were maimed or died for liberty and freedom across the world.
  - Mitch Sagraves
    
    Suz ~ Religion aside, Romney has lived his life helping others that were in need & displaying high moral values. That's why the MSM is running crazy trying to find any dirt on him. Oblahblah, on the other hand has tried to keep his past a secret but the dirt on him keeps coming forward….be sure your sins will find you out! Nuff said! Roaches do their thing when it's dark but when you turn on a light, they scatter & run. O is the biggest cock roach there is!! NOBAMA 2012!!
- canucksam
  
  The Dems took God off their platform. What does that tell you?
GWjr

Article states "
Politics and the processes of government are usually ugly affairs that only occasionally produce satisfying results."
That's pretty High & Mighty stuff, looking down your noses at civic politics, when church politics can get just as ugly and pathetic. Self-professed Christians might do better to understand that we are ALL badly flawed, and these flaws come out to be seen wherever humans organize themselves into groups, whether churches or political parties.
The only thing that should matter to right-thinking Americans is that President Obama is way farther to the left than our Founding Fathers would have liked, and that Mitt Romney, though far from the perfect alternative, is by far better than McCain was, and therefore we should support him in this election.
giley1

Yes we can because Romney shares our American values and respect for the very foundation of our Republic. Let's not forget that in 1960 the American people elected a Catholic president. Of course,that was a totally different Democratic Party. Kennedy also believed in our Republic and American values and had served his country in WW-ll.
- Robert30
  
  One more thing here…Romney ran from his chance to serve in the military and hid out in France. Just a little gift from his father.
Curry

Obama is a "Christ-ian"? Who gave you that bit of nonsense? Voting is not a religious function, it is a secular and civic function which must be guided by one's personal spiritual beliefs, whether or not one has a personal relationship with the author and founder of our nation, Jesus Christ.
Ergo, one is voting for a man who is seeking a secular political office, not a religious office. With respect to the difference between "Nobama" and Romney, it must be admitted that though the Mormons are regarded as a cult in many credible circles, they nonetheless demand that their people take care of their families and respect the laws of the land. Or would you rather reelect Nobama by not voting for Romney because he is a Mormon, Nobama that "yes I am by what I do", "no I am not by what I say" muslim, those lovely people with the medieval approach to anyone who doesn't think like they do? Nobama, that shameless traitor, poseur, fraud, political hack, and Muslim assassin?
"The Lord appoints all the princes and judges of the earth", so if these men are our choices, we need to get right with God so having to make a choice such as we are faced this with November never occurs again…
- Robert30
  
  Your statement reeks of hey! Here I am a mormon who believes in magical underwear and a guy with golden plates of rules that just mysteriously disappeared.
  Try to sell your tacky, satanic religion elsewhere.
http://www.facebook.com/howard.mctaggart Howard Joseph McTaggart

I really don't see much of a difference between a Christian voting for a Mormon this year and a Catholic in 1959, as I recall where was about as much a reaction towards JFK in his era as there is towards Romney now, and what needs to be done is they should look at Romney first as a republican and I personally feel the Republicans can do a better job than the Democrats.
Gmarshall

The basic issue here is a vote for either good or evil. Which candidate is pro-life? Which candidate is against abortion? Which candidate is for marriage between a man and a woman? Which candidate has demonstrated his faith by helping his fellow man in time of trials? The answer is perfectly clear and Christians who are concerned about who to vote should answer these questions first.
CK

Well heck yes you can…look at all the christian fools that felt it was necessary to vote for a black muslim because it made them feel good about themselves and they could tell all their firends…"look, I voted for a black"!
- Robert30
  
  He is hardly a black Muslim. That is the group headed by Dr. Farrakhan. Obama is a Christian from a well known Christian church.
jack

yes. obama ain't got no religion
pammeech

Yes we can and yes we will…..
Citizen Smith

What every Christian must do is vote. Not to vote means a vote for the wrong person. We must vote for the man who is a true American. A man who respects the Flag A man who love American, it constitution and it's liberties and freedoms.
Robert Ivy

I believe you wold be more accurate to call Obama a Muslim. A Christian would not support same-sex marriage. In fact, supporting same-sex mariage would be sinful and be acting opposite to being a Christian.
http://www.missiontoisrael.org/ Ted R. Weiland

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=IWDJEc92d38#!
gfsomsel

Let me ask another question: Can christians vote for a communist? And one more question: Are we about to elect our pastor? One more time: Were the Roman Emperors christians when the church started? I haven't read the full article in Christianity Today, but what I've seen appears to indicate that there isn't a problem for christians in voting for a Mormon.
donl

I'm a Catholic but I'll vote for a mormon before a Marxist Communist any day. Obama IS a hard core committed Communist. Just like his friends Hugo Chaves, Putin and Castro they start by selling you socialism then it propagates to Communism, of which I have seen up close and personal. Not a nice way to live !!
efred

I would disagree; the choice is not between a liberal-leaning Christian/Muslim and a Morman, but a athiestic Megalomaniac with an Egodiestic complex.
dolagibb

I wonder how many of those that voted for obama, thought he is a Christian??? When I saw some of the things that obama said, I knew he was't Christian! Said to myself who could vote for this guy! Boy I was wrong!
I think that most people that voted for him didn't really hear what he was saying or they didn't care!
Mcclain wasn't much better but thank God alone came Palin!! I thought that Palin could maybe lead Mccclain more to the right.
When I vote I am looking for the person that wil be closer to the right,
Even though Romney is a Christain and a Mornon, that is not the most inportant thing to me. I know that Romney can do a very job good , for he is experianced and has proven that he can do the job.
As presidents go obama is worst then Carter! At least Carter had a record of doing things! Even things he did turned out bad!
Enough said. Love DG
David M

To argue Obama is a christian is to declare you have no knowledge of Christianity. Obama, while being interviewed, said his 'Muslim' faith. He said the call to Muslim prayer is the most beautiful sound in the world. He shows support for Muslim countries including sending $700 million to help restore mosques around the world. In his book he said he would always side with his muslim brothers. The Muslim Brotherhood actually has direct access to the White House, look it up. However, he acts more like an anti-colonialist Kenyan socialist, like his father, than like a Muslim. And concerning Romney, does anyone actually believe his voting record, policies and political appointees represent Mormon beliefs? Give me a break. Should a follower of Jesus vote for either of these politicians? Read the Bible and the answer will be clear.
- Bighoss
  
  You don't need a "break." You need a brain repair.
G. Macher

Obama is not a Christian. He is a Muslim. Mormons may be wacky but they are not trying to kill us.
Harald

I am VOTEING FOR A PRESIDENT, not a MORMON, but a MAN
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1357090716 Jerry Morgan

Since Obama has been in office, he has never done anything Christian but he has done plenty things Muslim. This whole thing is a lame question. Always a Mormon over a Muslim. I still remember the Twin Towers and the over 19,000 terrorist attacks that killed people since the Twin Towers.
- Bighoss
  
  Bulletin! The President is NOT a Muslim and those who assert that he is are lame brains.
  - Bar-Eliam
    
    They can not be lame brains…they have NO brains.
    They are mormons trying to build a case to elect the moron/moromey!
    Do we really need to face having a president who lacks the ability to act independently and make major decisions and who believes hocus, pocus for a religion.
BohdanUke1

This writer must be from outer space. He should read Bob Williams & Ted's comments. Duh!
aceituna

Since God created us all unique so at no time can we find two persons that absolutely agree on everything, I will vote for the person whose political philosophy is closer to mine. I also fear the path we might take is Obama is really a Muslim (noone can say for sure either way) because of what their religion teaches. Mormons will not force anyone to adhear to a religion (such as Muslims do in the countries where they are in power) nor will they expect us to live according to Mormon precepts. Their philosophy in most ways parallel what Christians teach, and where they are encouraged to read the Bible members of their church can be Christian in spite of any false doctrine they teach. I trust that Mr. Romney would definitely make a much better president than what we now have.
Esther Mae Egan

If we vote God's way then we must vote for the best, and neither Obama or Romney fit that bill. Hosea 8:4 says we choose people who God does not know. The very first commandment says "thou shalt have no other gods before me". The Jews wanted a king, human king, instead of relying upon God as their king. They got into trouble and so have we. They choose a man that was handsome instead of a man of integrity and character. David had his flaws but we are told that even though sin came into his life he confessed his sin. Is Romney going to confess his sin. is he going to bring America today though prayer to almighty God? Romney support the killing of babies, has he repented and asked for forgiveness? Obama is running on a platform to kill babies. All babies are a gift of God . Why do we look at killing of babies different then all the people Hitler killed in Germany, it is the same. 2Chronicles 7:14 says if God's people will confess their sins and humble themselves before God, He will heal our land. Killing of the innocent babies is our fault, were are we in doing what we can to save them. As long as we do not look in that direction we can forget them. Every one says, most everyone says, we need to vote for the lesser of to evils. Evil is still evil and Obama and Romney are only different in skin color. Why do we think God only acknowledges Republican or Democrat Party, Don't you think maybe a Independent of Constitution Party with a solid God fearing people is better then evil? At one time there was no Republican or Democrat Party, they evolved in time . I think it is time for a change again. The only reason Goode can not make it is because we do not vote for him, or any Independent. We have had wonderful men on the Independent ticket and they lost because we do not think outside the box of Republican.
tarbella

I'll go with Romney. And by the way, go see 2016. I just did and it is very interesting.
Byron

99% of christains do not believe that Mormons are Christians. The Mormon beliefs I do not agree with at all, but, I much rather vote for a Mormon President then for a Black President who supports gay marriage.
- agbjr
  
  99%? Please justify your comment … include polling sources.
jimmy john

Yes Christian's can vote for Mormon, But not for a sorry Muslim, So vote for Romney, and don't listen to all the Crap coming out of Obama's mouth after all, clinton is backing him and he's liar takes one to know one
dfijan

First of all, Romney is far from a conservative. Second, all this article does is help so called christians justify compromising and voting for Romney; two things God would never ask a true believer to do….compromise and justify. Righteous decisions do not need justifying; only sinful ones do. Christians need to stop being afraid of man (Obama and/or Romney) and start repenting and turning back to God!
- Robert30
  
  Right on brother! Our group certainly supports your statements.
  The Christians here seem to live in deep fear and compromise their beliefs due to the bigotry.
Johnny

Johnny younger@q.com
David M

Voting for the lesser of two evils is still voting for evil. The German people voted for Hitler fearing the communists were more evil. I suppose they were right considering how many Stalin murdered compared to those Hitler murder. Does that mean voting for Hitler was the Christian choice as he was the lesser of two evils? Would Jesus have voted for Hitler? Will positive change ever occur if people continue to compromise rather than work to correct the problem? I think not. Romney is just as much a murderer with his votes for abortion.
http://pulse.yahoo.com/_TFABB6NXHV2A3FIL6LGV36GQTY Vince

Mormonism is indeed a cult. You can't simultaneously believe that there are multiple gods and that God himself was once a man without coming across as a heretic who has fallen head first for the lies perpetuated to the gullible. I can't vote for either of these deceptive false choices.
PecosSal

Mormons are Christian, they have added to the bible as have all Christian's when they read, study and agree with others that say how the Bible should be interpreted. None of us can judge which Christian God loves.
agbjr

As a faithful Christian and Constitution-abiding proud United States citizen I am thoroughly disgusted by this article! Why is there no by-line? Is the author of such bigoted trash afraid to put his name to it? Mormons – members of the Church of JESUS CHRIST and Latter Day Saints – are as the official name of their Church implies Christians. Those who continue to label Mormons as cultists and non-Christians are either uneducated or total bigots … and no American should be so ignorant.

ROMNEY/RYAN 2012 … to reinstate the Constitution and preserve OUR Republic.
Lynn

Is it wrong to vote for someone who has a record in not telling the truth, a birth certificate, college records and the like? Is is right to vote for someone who believes in God's word, Jesus, the New Testament and salvation but is different in some ways than the Protestant Faith? Is it fair to vote for someone who has had four years to raise the standard of living in this country, the jobless rate and has raised the debt to heights that will take us years and years to pay off? Is it right to vote for someone new and fresh, who has chosen a candidate for Vice President that is so articulate, well spoken, informed and presents himself in such a professional manner?
I would say that it is a "no-brainer"
- Robert30
  
  "I would say that it is a "no-brainer"
  You are absolutely correct voting for Romney and Ryan(who is turning out to be a bigtime liar)
  takes no brain at all. You certainly are in good company.
Steve Spence

Obama is not a Christian, according to his own statements. Not even a left leaning Liberal one. You muddy the waters by attaching the Christian label to him.
Bill

true believers will have to swallow hard and vote for the man that is pro-life and anti sodomy. based on Romans 13 those who constitute civil authority are the ministers of GOD for good of their land. they may not know this themselves. even so we must pray for them as of first importance. this is what we learn from 1 Timothy 2:1-4. PRAYUSA
Walt

Can a Christian be left leaning and liberal. No rather the Christian who is born again is God leaning. Leaning on Him for everything because the Christian understands that their is nothing good in their flesh.
trust god

I would vote for Mickey Mouse before I vote for Obama,.Voting for A muslim is like voting for satan.
As far as a Momon go's they are good people.
- Bighoss
  
  Bulletin! The President is NOT a Muslim! Now you can reconsider your vote.
  
  P.S. The word is "Mormon", not "Momon." And it is "goes," not "go's".
Mex Seiko

It is God who sets up and takes down governments. He called Nabukednezzar His servant and Sirus His annointed. For sometime now, several Christian leaders and pastors have been expecting great judgment over America for the sins of the nation. God used the king of Babylon to punish the Jewish nation for violating Jubilee. American Evangelicals don't recognize Clinton, Bush, Obama, and perhaps now Romney as a process by which God is setting up the nation's judgment. America is increasingly abandoning her faith, Atheism is on the rise, abortion is strong, corruption in the financial industry increases, our military grows more secular and proportionally immoral. Scandals of immorality also increase in our government. All of this is conducive to judment. It's not who you vote for, but what you vote for. Americans, Christians and otherwise have been voting their pockets, their skin, or sexual disorders. Not real conscience or desire for the good of the country factors into the vote. Only selfish motives. Our president is not our spiritual leader, but is what we deserve, because is what we have asked for. Obama exemplifies how the country is either made stronger or weaker by our choices. This question is not whether it is ok for a Christian to vote for a man who's faith is in a cult, but Why dear God do we not have a choice? We did have various choices, we just didn't accept them.
http://www.facebook.com/wampus133 Sandra Kessler

At this point in time and the damage alone done by this president does it matter if a Mormon gets elected. This Mormon can count, read and understand the Constitution of the United States. Picked a Catholic Christian as a running mate. So for the Republican ticket we have a Christian Mormon and a Christian Catholic. Sounds like the person to purposed this question is really agianst all Christianity and needed a point for discussion to place questions in others minds. Those who have a problem with Mormons just need to look we put a black man-who is a Muslim-who invissions himself to be God like and our dictator and you have the nerve to worry about a Mormon.
Guest

For the past several Presidential elections, the RNC has presented to Republican voters, Independents, and Conservative Christians a team usually headed by a neo-con globalist for President and a Tea-Party (like) conservative Vice President. When the VP has no authority to make change then it is nothing but a "show-and-tell" position the Republican elites put forward to get conservative and Christian votes. Do not be deceived again. But, God forbid, do not re-elect Obama.
http://www.facebook.com/mrs.jc1 Mrs. James Clemons

I have realized that more than ever Prayer for the ones who are lost souls, whether they be from one party or the other is needed. They need to know the Truth of the Gospel, and to see that Jesus is the Real Lord and God of the Universe. They need to know that the Bible is true, and is going to be proven true as the events unfold before us. When I think of the Scriptures, and have studied them these days ahead do not appear to be positive, no matter how much we want it to be postive. No matter who wins, it's going to be downhill for many even though both promise what they think the people want to hear. That's called propaganda whether it be from one party or the other. So one must pray for discernment and ask the Lord to guide them in their time of voting. I have a lot of trouble with either cannidate, though I know they both profess to do what they think is best for the country at large. The running vp's may sound a little better to some and not so good to the others. They need prayer too, to come to the Truth of the Gospel and know that Salvation is not by works but by faith in HIM. He will lead if you are a True Christian, but not all who are Christians obey God, and that's where the trouble is. Morman religion gives us the 'face' of what is suppose to be right and many times may outshine Christians in their external efforts. But God knows the hearts and souls of those who are lost. He knows the motivations of the heart and can see through the works. Yes I can agree that they are kind people and do desire what is best, but the sad part is the doctrine that is not totally clear. Definitions of who Jesus is from their understanding verses what the Christian believes is not the same. Think about it , if you had been brought up to believe that you are a Christian without confessing your sins, without knowing that you have to repent of those sins, and that Peace comes from confession then you will be sadly mistaken at the time of your death. Muslim religion is also a religion of works, and so not different from the mormans in that respect. But neither one is Christian. Both have the 'wolves, heart underneath the 'sheep's wool ' covering their bodies, but whose going to see that ?GOD does . There is a passage in Corinthians that aptly describes the ones of the many cults that you see today, and this is what Christians are having to face when they make their decision in the voting booth. Only GOD can truly change the hearts of the lost, and that is what is crucial to do here so they can see the Truth of God and confess their sins, and make that public before the vote comes. IF that does not happen there will be jeporady for us either way.
philote

A Christian is one who follows Christ, who proclaims the Gospel to the lost, who esteems others as more important than himself, who blesses those who spitefully use him, who prays for the peace of Jerusalem, who….

Oh well, guess there's no need to waste any more bandwidth. BHO is not remotely Christian in deed, and indeed he is no Christian. Mene, Mene, Tekel, Upharsin
Evermyrtle

How can a Christian vote for someone who is not a Christian? When we think about the fact this is the only choice we have/ When we remember his voting records in favor of abortion and homosexuality, while he still says that he has no problem of putting an orphan child into at same sex married couple home? I have heard of the 64 dollar question, now it has hit me squarely in the face
Mary

What is the matter with you people? I didn't realize how truly naive and insular you at Zionica are. I am American who lives in London, and maybe I've just had a bit more experience with Muslims, but you are totally stupid if you think Obama is NOT a Muslim. I knew he was a Muslim in December of 2007, when his name started coming up as a possible candidate. I took ONE look at the Chicago Trinity Church and I said to my sister, "That is not a Christian church — that is a pro-African site." Can you imagine a church website whose home page is a map of Africa, and the name of Jesus NEVER appears anywhere in the website? I knew, and almost every week since there has been a long catalogue of events and articles which have reinforced my view. In fact, in four years and nine months, not ONE thing done or said about Obama or by Obama has made me doubt AT ALL his Muslim faith. I can't name here ALL of the proofs, the list is too long. Start reading — and I don't mean mainstream media, because you won't get the truth there — do your own research and stop this ridiculous question about voting for a Mormon. I'd vote for an avowed atheist before I would vote for Obama. The main goal of Islam is world domination, and they are achieving it in almost every country in the world; Obama has personally helped immensely in stirring up the "Arab spring", which has resulted in the Muslim Brotherhood's taking control in Egypt, Libya, and even Tunisia. I can't go on here, but I find it EXTREMELY frustrating that you CANNOT see what is in front of your eyes. Unfortunately, when you DO see it, it may be too late for America, and for the world.
- Bighoss
  
  Get real, Mary. Maps do not a Muslim make. But, hey, go ahead and rely on whatever wing nut sources and ASSumptions you like. I suspect you get your information from such nutjob sources as Joseph Farah and his ilk. It is you whose vision of things is blurred.
BitterClinger

What I find quite amusing about the whole fake "Left vs Right" is how people from both sides are willing to turn a blind eye to the blatant corruption of their own candidate. We are told that we absolutely have to vote along party lines, even if we are basically voting for mirror images.
Romney, if you look at his history, is not conservative. He STILL supports abortion, he basically wrote ObamaCare, he supports sending our jobs overseas, he loves carbon taxes, and he loves a big government.
Stop believing everything "your guy"says just because he calls himself the same thing you do.
James C. Harrison

Isn't anybody thinking outside the box any more? Mitt Romney's Mormonism is beyond the question. So is his membership in the Council on Foreign Relations. So is his choice of a running mate (Paul Ryan) who voted with Barney Frank to force religious organizations to hire perverts and his voting for funding Obama Care.

"Taking back America" involves a whole lot more than returning to a Lockean document that claims to be "the supreme law of the land" (even above God's law) and forbids any religious test for its leaders (Article 6) when the Bible calls for men who fear God to lead the nation. We are not merely ripe for judgment; we are in the judgment. As a culture, we slipped away long ago. God is not mocked. it is His law or chaos. it is the crown rights of King Jesus or tyranny. There is still time for the silent pulpits to call America back to God's revealed law. Natural law has evolved into social Darwinism. Accept no substitutes..
1775concord

Perhaps you didn't see Obama on George Steph's Sunday AM TV program in Oct 2008, where Obama clearly said, "Mu Muslim faith." Steph caught it and corrected Obama a few seconds later.
Point: Obama has said publicly he is a Muslim. No Christian would have ever uttered those words. All this later planned professed talk by Obama that he is a Christian is garbage, and fully at odds with what Obama said in an unguarded moment.
- Bighoss
  
  Get real! That old "my Muslim faith" stuff has been decisively shown to be a distortion and misrepresentation of the conversation between Obama and Stephanopolis. Here is a link to the TRUTH, although I doubt it will make any difference to a deluded true believer such as you:
  
  http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/muslimfaith.asp
rick

living in a town founded by mormons, i have far more respect for their way of life than that of catholics and all other sinful denominations. the church of latter day saints is not feared by myself or other family members. i'm no romney fan but, the question is stupid, considering the options.
http://www.facebook.com/people/Howard-Fisher/1581409640 Howard Fisher

Folk's we are not voting for a spritual leader in this election, as Christians we already have ours and he would be named Jesus. The Constitution demands that there be no religious test for our elected officials. That said Mitt Romney being morman, even if it doesn't fit within the beliefs that many Christians hold, he still appears to be a good and honorable man, who will not only respect our rights he will protect them. Mitt Romney is not asking America to follow his religion, he is asking America to trust him in that he will get up and go to work everyday to make our country the best it can be.
Brent

Robert 30 you would make a good democratic politician, because every time you open your mouth crap runs out. YOU don't know anything about christianity or Obama for that . You should pull your head out of the sand and try to learn what is really goin on around you. Obama loves people like you because you are so gullible. You don't even know the real name of the church that Romney belongs to and yu are trying to say what they believe. Get a clue bud.
guest

I definitely don't see Obama as any kind of Christian or anyone who votes for him. Didn't they publicly denounce God from the platform?
Soteria Allen

I am a Christian. I don't like to say bad things about people, but as I know God would rather we do in most cases, pray for them instead. I have prayed for Mitt Romney. And will continue to, and for his family. But I believe this is one of those cases, as they are also in the Bible (John the baptist, Jesus, many martyred prophets…) God wants us to speak up and ALERT PEOPLE about something very dangerous! I have done research on Mitt Romney, and there are reasons to NOT VOTE FOR HIM!! Good Christian people, like former Christian Presidential candidate Alan Keyes, says as Christians we DO have a choice. We don't have to choose between EVIL or EVIL. We don't HAVE TO endorse EVIL!! From my research I also have found to side (vote for–into office) with Mitt Romney is to endorse EVIL!! Mitt Romney was Governor as Massachusetts and therefore has a record. Clear in his record is seen HE LIES!! Very deceitful!! By the things he has said and done, he could be Obama's twin. Even calling himself a Republican and also a conservative is more deceit. He could easily fit in with the LIBERAL DEMOCRATS, including having George Soros connections. If you go to http://www.massresistance.org you will see much documentation of EVIL!! Governor Romney illegally unconstitutionally used an executive order as governor to create a law allowing 'Gay Marriage'. A Pioneer in that evil; Massachusetts was the 1st state to have gay marriage, and a precedent for others to look to and use! I love homosexuals and have helped a few out, by the power of God and His Word, of that very dark, hurtful deception! Yes, the whole country was watching as Massachusetts, by what Mitt Romney did for the homosexuals (much involvement with them in his Bain Capital—'capitalist Romney'. Hedge funds. Soros connections. Look it up for yourself; the info is there. Do we need to have another UNVETTED PRESIDENT? And what his socialized medicine known as Romneycare had to pay for homosexuals—hair removal for transgenders, psychological help for transgenders, etc. I also believe there are problems with a person living out their Mormon religion beliefs and from those beliefs making decisions, being in a ruling position in our country, unless we are ready to no longer be ruled by Judeo/Christian beliefs, what our nation was founded on and our founding documents written from. I'm not ready for that, and I believe most Americans aren't either–but could be deceived into losing that
'righteousness that exalts a nation'–Biblical Christianity—the TRUTH! From what I've read, Romney is a TRUE BELIEVER of Mormonism; and it includes expecting the Mormon god to reign, including having a Mormon as President of the US, to help bring a MORMON THEOCRACY. That is not the God of the Christians nor of the Bible, which we know is the TRUTH! (no matter what Mormons—I love the people—might say) What relation does a devout Mormon have in bringing the rule of the Mormon god to pass? I believe that affects Mitt Romney, his lying and 'doing whatever it takes' to get in political position to help bring our country under what we know is a false religion, even working in partnership with Marxist/Islamist, including using the homos as a tool of tyranny. But, even if religion wasn't a part (but I believe we need to consider it when we think about how a person will decide and act) just on the documented statements and legal decisions he has made as governor and as presidential candidate, we should say "No way!!!" Check!! We don't have to have another "UNVETTED PRESIDENT". The mainstream media has stayed away from these issues, not because they want a 'conservative Republican' in the White House. No, on the contrary! Instead, because they AGREE with the Liberal (Marxist/Islamist–Look him up!) homo and pro-abortion (Yes, he LIES!) Obama twin candidate and don't want the truth shown that would cause most of America to reject him. Another site you go to is http://www.renewamerica.org (articles by Alan Keyes, Cliff Kincaid, Linda Harvey—all Christians; exposing Romney) Also, http://www.usasurvival.org with Cliff Kincaid. By the way, there is a good Christian man running for President this time. I believe God will get him known in time to win. (A Miracle–but God can!! Hurray!!) His name is Pastor Terry (& wife Sylvia) Jones. There are lies on-line about him because he speaks openly about some hot but very hurtful topics that need to be brought up, like homosexuality, and the spread of Islam (Shariah Law) in our country. So keep searching if it looks bad regarding Pastor Jones. His videos at Stand Up America Now (Youtube) tell much about this beautiful, Christian man. I believe we will be reading about him much more, in the near future. Please look up Romney, particularly at a site where Christians, Jews, and others in Massachusetts have suffered and want everyone ALERTED to the TRUTH about this man, at http://www.massresistance.org. With Jesus' Compassion 4 America (& the world), Soteria Allen
darrelljr

A Christian would never sat we are no longer a Christian nation0 under any context.
Not all Christians are your friends nor your enemies
Nazarene

"Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven, but he that doeth my Father’s will which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not by thy Name prophesied? And by thy name cast out devils? And by thy name done many great works? And then will I profess to them, I never knew you, depart from me ye that work iniquity." (Matthew 7:21-23 1599 Geneva Bible)
mike

Gov. Romney was no where near my first choice but one has to deal with the hand as dealt and it is clearly less dangerous to vote for Romney than to vote for the proven disaster of BHO. Even if Mitt had a secret plan (which I doubt) to bring the US under the thumb of the LDS Church I do not believe that he would be able to accomplish it. If given four more years I am confident that King Hussein will succeed in his attempt to destroy this country.
bigbubba

The real ? is can we reelect the moron now that we have seen what he has done and his convention has removed GOD
- Bar-Eliam
  
  The best thing that could ever be done in to get that fake god out of american politics.
  I say god damn the republicons and the US for all the wars it has created with no basis for them.
  America needs to be damned for interfering in other countries business just to take over and control their resources.
  I hope to live long enough to see the US go down in flames just like ancient Rome. That would be good for starters.
Bill

We aren't voting to get a Sunday school teacher,we are voting to get a leader before that imposter,liar,maybe Muslum , destroys the whole country. Being a "good christian" don't necessarily
make a good President…(Jimmy Carter)
A fellow Christian

Why would a church use the name of Jesus Christ in its name if it does not worsip Jesus? Example = the Mormon church is called "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints." They preach of Christ and teach of Christ. Seems pretty Christain to me. I think there are a lot of misinformed people on here.
Donald E. Evett

Let it be known to all who profess to the world that the Mormon religion is not a Christian religion are wrong. Shame on everyone who advocate such. I was a Catholic, Methodist, Church of God, Seven Day Adventist. and then a Mormon. I have been a Christian all my life, and what is taught in the Mormon Church is no different than all the religious churches that I have belong to over my life Span. We worship the same Heavenly Father and His beloved Son Jesus Christ. There are over 14 million members world wide with over 50,000 missionaries serving around the world. People of other faiths should never express hatred towards another religion, for people around the world have the right to worship as their hearts so desire. When so called Christians of another faith denounce another faith, they are wrong in doing so, as they should love one another as the Savior said: "Love one another as I have loved you." I am as much a Christian as anyone else in this world, and I am most knowledgeable in scriptures of the Bible. God loves me and so does my Savior, Jesus Christ.
- Bighoss
  
  If Mormonism is basically no different from the other churches you have rambled through, one is inclined to wonder just why you successively joined and then left so many of them. It is obvious that you have learned very little about Mormon doctrine or you would not have concluded that the Mormon cult is no different from those other churches. Methinks that during your protracted ecumenical pilgrimage, you must have been pursuing something other than Biblical truth. Which church will be your next choice?
http://www.facebook.com/howard.grant.90 Howard Grant

Oh yes…..he's a MORMON. We need to be very afraid of that very strange religion that teaches its members to be clean-living, patriotic, fiscally conservative, charitable, self-reliant, and honest.
- Bar-Eliam
  
  And we all know mormons who force their underage daughters into marriages with old men.
  So much for respect of the female. To them women are the beast of burden and it is all theirs.
  They are a bunch of putzes.
  - Ron
    
    Have you ever looked at Islam?
- Bighoss
  
  And also teaches that God had physical sexual intercourse with Mary in the same way that mortals have sexual intercourse and that Jesus was the product of that union. And also teaches that Jesus and Satan were at one time brothers in heaven. And also teaches that
  Mormon men can progress to a state of godhood such as that of God Himself.
  
  Clean-living, patriotic, fiscally conservative, charitable, self-reliant and honest HERETICS!
  - Bar-Eliam
    
    But you forgot…they also get their own planet. What a life being a god, having hundreds of wives and ruling your own planet. WOW!
    What were J. Smith and bring-em Young smoking!
http://twitter.com/akrongarber Paul D Garber

I'd like to point out to Robert30 that Dr. Jeremiah Wright was a Marine for 2 years (1961 to 1963). Another ex-Marine served one month short of 3 years (1956 to 1959) in the Corps. His name was Lee Harvey Oswald, so even the Marine Corps can make mistakes once in a while. I'd also like to ask you why Barack Obama mentioned his "Muslim Heritage" but never his "Christian Heritage.? He may not be a Muslim but he IS a Marxist and therefore cannot be a Christian as they are mutually exclusive. You remind me of all the other left wing nut's who insist that we are better off now than in 2008 when Obama claimed that adding 3 trillion dollars to the debt in eight (8) years was Treason & yet he gets a pass on adding 5 trillion in 3 1/2 years?
- Bar-Eliam
  
  You are a stupid fool. Dr. Wright was in the marines and retired after 20years. We were at his retirement ceremonies.
  He is a great man and is truly a religious one.
  So who cares what President Obama is. We, in the constitution, don't support a litmus test for president.
  Everyone around me supported the president on the first go round and now I know at least twice as many will be supporting him again.
  He is a wonderful, great president.
  My only sorrow is that the Democratic platform gave in to the nuts to put the god and jewish stuff back in. No real Demo supports a god plank nor an israel plank. They should be pulled up and burned.
  We don't need god of any-kind least of all the right wing loonies versions.
  The Democrats have a superior way of life and yes we are ever so much better off than 4 years ago when bush messed up everything.
Douglas

Please where does anyone actually think Obama is a Christian of any type?? A Islamic followers yes, but a left Christian….his wife may be and he goes to her church…but Obama has a blanket and ko'ran…look at his history since taking office!! Look at his DNC platform…come on.

Rather or not you have an opinion of Mormons, both Donney and Maria are Mormons, and fact be known…some of the most Honest People I know happen to be Mormons. At one time m,any didn't smoke (no ashtrays found in their homes, or TV's…but over the years they have lightened up some of their rules…but family is and always will be front and center of their lives!

So don't be mislead by all of the foolishness we faced during the 2008 election…look at the past 3 years and 9 months and decide if you want more of the same or real change??
petroskhan

As some others have pointed out, the choice is simple.

A Mormon, who has some goofy ideas about religion, and, aside from that, has been a great success in his life, and apparently wants to help this country.

A…well…we don't know. He describes the muslim call to prayer as the most beautiful sound on earth, speaks fluent arabic, and was raised a muslim, went to an America-hating "christian" church, and bows to every world leader who isn't white, and has worked very hard to destroy our economy, making it worse than it was when he took office, while blaming anyone but himself.

Hey, it's tough, but it's your call.
HerrCapitanFick

I don't know if a Christen can vote for a Mormon, but I do know the morons can vote for a Muslim! Now you morons go figure!
- Bighoss
  
  The true morons are those who continue to insist that the President is a Muslim.
canucksam

I'm a Roman Catholic and will vote for Romney with a clear conscience. From all I've observed, heard and read he is an honest man, devoted to his church, family and country, goes out of his way to help others without any fanfare, has integrity; is highly intelligent and when he says he will get the job done he does it. The other choice flips-flops from declaring he's a Muslim to he's a Christian then he's a Muslim; has trampled on our Constitution; is denigrating our military; divided the country by color and gender; makes up stores which he tells over and over and believes them; has sealed all of his records' has never helped his own family; and not once has he said he loves this country.
So, my choice is very simple – there's really only 1 choice – Mitt Romney.
http://openid.aol.com/botighecatfan Joeboo

I'm a southern baptist and Romney's religion has no effect on deterring me from voting for him especially since Obama is not a Christian but a muslim. If Obama were a Christian he would not support abortion, gay unions and continuously lie about everything.
http://www.facebook.com/people/Scott-Davis/100001900465642 Scott Davis

Christians, with no brains, voted for that really creepy closet Muslim Obama, so I have no problem, at all, to cast my vote for Mitt the Mormon.
- Bighoss
  
  The President is not a muslim, notwithstanding the constant blithering wing-nut ASSertions to the contrary. Grow up.
Bonnie Bell

To focus on the question: Can a Christian vote for a Mormon? Absolutely!! Since they are Christians, why not…why is a Muslim in the White House?? because he lied…he said he was a Christian, but I also heard him say he is a Muslim. So there..He sat in a Black Liberation Theology church for 20 years listening to a man say G.. D… America. How could a true Christian who worships God the Father, God the Son, Jesus, listen to that?? Barack is not a friend of the American people. He was raised by Communists (his grandparents the Dunhams) His mentor growing up was a card carrying communist. He never set foot in the mainland USA until he went to college, so he never grew up with the American Experience, in small town America like we did. He is out of touch with most Americans. He has a Socialist/Communist agenda for America, including bringing down the US to the status of a third world Nation by taking away our Sovereignty, our money, our rights as citizens under the Constitution. This man has no respect for the flag (wouldn't even raise his hand to his chest) refused to wear a flag pin at first. He hates America and his wife was never proud of this country until Barack became president. On the other hand Mitt Romney is a Christian man who we know where he was born, where he went to church, who he is (history) a business man, a loving father and husband. A man who took no pay as governor of Mass. no pay as the head of the Olympics,etc. the list goes on…Mitt is a man who prays to God in the name of Jesus Christ every day. He will surround himself with good Christian people to guide this country…Mitt is the man for president.
- http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
  
  Amen!
- listra
  
  you are a fool
http://www.facebook.com/people/Teri-Mount-McCall/100001392291805 Teri Mount McCall

Mormonism is NOT a Christian religion! I wish people would stop being deceived and/or quit lying about this!

Helpful link to help Christians understand Mormonism's differences with Christianity. http://carm.org/mormonism

"Mormonism, also known as the Church of Jesus Christ
of Latter-day Saints, claims to be the restoration of the true gospel
and a revelation of the true God. Find out about its teachings of men
becoming gods, temples, the Book of Mormon, and Joseph Smith who claimed
to have seen God the Father."
Sparten1

The question is, can a Christian vote for a Muslim? I'd vote for the devil himself before I'd vote for the muslim.
- Bar-Eliam
  
  A vote for moromney is the same as voting for SATAN!
SEABEETOM

I would vote for a Mormon before I would vote for a commie muslim..
- Bighoss
  
  You don't have to make that choice, since the President is neither a commie nor a muslim, notwithstanding the constant blithering wing-nut ASSertions to the contrary. Grow up.
citizenrights

How about a devout communist and a fascist, capitalist corporate Mormon. Both have different designs but altimetry desire the same thing basically. One world government and that the people are here to serve not be served.
citizenrights

The problem here is they are both occult. The King James Holy Bible: The First Letter of Paul, To the Corinthians
- http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
  
  Wrong again.
JohnMc2

I have always believed that a Christian is someone that believes that Jesus Christ is the son of God. Both the "Book of Mormon" and the "New Testament" state this. To say that a Mormon is not a Christian is contradictory to this concept. Before drawing any conclusions on this concept,read both the "Book of Mormon" and the "New Testament in the "Holy Bible". The Mormons use the "New Testament" as a reference in practicing their religion. If you really want to know about the philosophy of one of the non-christian religions take the time to read the "Quran".
- petroskhan
  
  I've taken the time to read all of the books you mention. Well, I've read most of the Book of Mormon, and about half of the koran (about all of it I could stand).
  
  That said, Mormons (or LDS's, if that makes you more comfy inside) are NOT what anyone being truly objective would call "Christian". Their core beliefs are, in far too many respects, contrary to the Bible, and their core doctrines as to the identity and nature of God and Jesus are not "in step" with the Bible.
  
  As for the koran…wow. A more hate-filled tome of hogwash and ramblings I've never run across. The Satanic Bible (which I've also read) is more mellow and tolerant than the koran. Murder, rape, assassination, lying, stealing…all condoned when done in the name of Allah. Pretty much any evil and vile act is acceptable under islam, you just need the right excuse, and there are plenty of them.
  
  So, in this election…I'll take the Mormon. At least HE doesn't want to replace our laws with his own ideas of how we should all live. And he's got a pretty good track record in his personal life. Hey, we even know where he was born.
LouiseCA

Some people may be right in their hearts but wrong in their heads. In other words, they're in a church that is preaching wrong doctrine but don't realize it yet, but they have actually accepted Christ. How about praying for them instead of condemning and criticizing them?
- http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1190287592 Jeannetta Noble Stokes
  
  I beg your pardon?! Because we disagree doesn't make us "wrong in their heads". Do you, in your church agree with the Catholics? Presbyterians? Methodists? How do you know it isn't YOU that's "wrong in the head"? Your arrogance and ignorance are telling.
determented

Just how many black churches or white churches have truly ordained Christian Ministers and how many put Reverend before their name to reap the benefits and are false profits that put worldly give away programs and encourage people to reap what they didnt sow and to be moochers? the Holy Bible tells us to help the sick and helpless and widows and children but as far as others who are able to work and dont it says dont feed them. How many people are drawing benefits and scamming the system and stealing from those who really need it? God gives us the sense to tell the difference between the sparrow and the adder and we can surely tell by a persons deeds if he is truly a Christian and a Minister of the Gospel.
Gerald Hallman

As a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, I am a convert to the church. I grew up a Baptist, where I visited many chuches as the son of a Baptist minister and went to church every week. However, I felt some of the teachings did not make sense and I was wanting answers that went beyond, that is a mystery of God and we don't need to know. I had long talks with my father and spent long hours in prayer and study before I joined the church. The one thing I have noticed everyone has different beliefs about the church and most based on things they have been told by someone else. All this aside, the main idea of the upcoming election is not based on the religous beliefs of the president but his political beliefs. The rights of individuals, the rights of a baby in the womb, the strength of the Constitution and the support of the Laws defined by by that document with deliniated functions of each branch of the government. It is important to change from a liberal view to a conservative view so we can keep our religous freedoms, to worship as we feel brings us closer to God and his son.
determented

I will surely tell you a man who covers up anything pertaining to Christ before he makes a speech and professes to be a Christian and shares a platform that does not allow Christ is not a Christian in my opinion and he leans toward the Muslims i will accept him as a Muslim. I will vote for Romney
- Esther
  
  How about the stance taken by Obama to allow the killing of a baby while it is being born? If you can possibly imagine this!!! This is the man we now have as president!
- Bighoss
  
  The President is not a Muslim, notwithstanding the constant blithering wing-nut ASSertions to the contrary.
Nanny

Obama is not a Christian..He is a Muslim!! Romney may be a Morman but he believes marriage is between a man and a woman.That's how God designed marriage.Obama does not believe marriage is between a man and woman… Romney believes in protecting the unborn who do not have a voice..life begins at conception. count backwards from 9 months when does it cease to be a baby (to kill a fetus doesn't sound so bad but to kill a baby it's murder.)..So as a Christian we are to vote for the person who is closest to our Biblical beliefs and what God says..
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=726376468 Mary Graves

The question is, "Can a Christian Vote for a Mormon?" The answer is, "Yes".
Gordon

Let's get it straight, we want the Romney/Ryan ticket to win in Nov., and we want the communist usurper, Obama, out,out,out!
As far as the contention on this thread, let's be clear: there is only one real church, the church the only begotten son of God, the resurrected Jesus Christ said he would build and that the gates of Hades would not prevail against. He, Jesus is the head of the church and all who are saved by grace through faith, not of works, are regenerated by The Holy Spirit of God and constitute His body in the earth. Heaven has not endorsed any particular ecclesiastical organization or theological clubs. The people just described abide in the vine (Christ) and are therefore alive in Him. He said, "my sheep hear my voice, and they follow me"!
- petroskhan
  
  Now THAT I will agree with 100%. Very nicely stated. Thank you.
mallen11

I am voting for Romney against -0. I like the idea of a business man being president. I do not accept mormonism as a Christian organization but a cult. Search for yourself; open your eyes to the truth. I don't have to accept his religion but I would encourage everyone to search for themselves the truth abount what Mormons believe so they will not be fooled into accepting it.

Mormon Madness Exposed: the Bible vs. the Book of Mormon
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e49POJrQv2I&feature=related

And see: http://www.utlm.org/onlinebooks/changecontents.htm
http://www.utlm.org/navonlinebooks.htm
Book by Walter Martin – Kingdom of the Cults – especially page 206, 226 = Mormonism

They appear orthodox but distorted – misappropriation of beliefs Man made beliefs; just like the Islamic religion. Satan knows how to fool people and he has done a good job with the mormons.

Mormonism teaches that Jesus is just one of countless other gods—a belief known as polytheism. Now, a Mormon may try to deny being a polytheist by affirming the existence of other gods, while in the same breath worshipping only God the Father. However, don’t forget Christ’s proclamation
in Mark chapter 12—that God’s most important commandment is to recognize that there is only one God and only one Lord.
- Esther
  
  But like it or not Mr Allen, Romney is successful because of his public service since he was eight years old, when he reached the age of accountability, as is taught to every Mormon child. It is taught in detail. See the Strength of Youth pamphlet.
  - mallen11
    
    We have some strong legalistic religious Mormons in our neighborhood who have boys that my granddaughters play with across the street at the park and and they are both over 8 years of age and have not been taught what you say. The greatest thing is that in witnessing to them about the God of the Bible they have seen the fallacy of their false religion and became a believer in the one and only Jesus Christ of the Bible. Yes, Mormons are taught to live by establishment princples and are usually good people but the ones I have encountered have not been pleasant people especially since they think they are so much better than anyone else who isn't a Mormon. That is NOT Christianity.
    - Esther
      
      They likely feel threatened by you, as I have felt. Those children are taught they are children of God, as are your children. But your children live in an atmosphere, through no fault of their own, of being told all the time they are sinners. A Mormon child is never taught that as we believe babies are born pure and become knowledgeable about doing wrong by just being in the world. It is a testing ground to be here. You should respect their beliefs. But no matter, if their parents are strong, their children will feel safe in spite of the negative testimony, as you told me you give to them, of the fallacy of their religion. I promise you won't win them in the long run. They don't think they are better people to degrade you, they think they are good people because they are children of a good and gracious God and they remember it everyday.
      - mallen11
        
        As usual, there is no reasoning to your comment. I have no idea what you are talking about with regard to babies. We are all born with a sin nature passed down through the ages from Adam and all people have been given the opportunity to hear the gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ and believe in Him for eteranl salvation. Your cult religion is totally against what the Bible teaches about living the Christian way of life. Your religion teaches to be good but it will not get you to heaven or have a relationship with Christ here on earth. BTW, it is too late, the boys have already believed in the Lord Jesus Christ as their savior and no one can snatch them from God the Father's "hands".
        How sad that so many have been led astray in the cult of Mormonism by the cleverness of Satan.
      - Esther
        
        Yes, the boys learned about the real Jesus Christ in the Mormon church and you will take credit in your church, as your intimidation has caused their relenting to your wishes. They are young and they know they were born pure. I assure you they are the purest people in your church at this point, since they are set to give you testimonial to an extent you have never before experienced. It is from the Book of Mormon and not from you Mr. Allen. Though they will let you think so.
      - mallen11
        
        From your comments, the LDS "church" is more screwed up than I thought. It is not my church but the Word of God that helped those boys to believe in the Lord Jesus Christ of the Bible. My granddaughters were the ones who talked to them; I did not. No one is born "pure" since we are all born with a sin nature because of Adam. The book of mormon is a fairy tale made up from a man who was know to tell tall tales. It was all for money. Even the giving of 10% tithe to the church is not Biblical. You have been duped to believe false information. Do a research from ex-mormons who have absolute proof that mormonism is a made up belief by a mere man. BTW, those boys told the girls things that they were able to counter with the Word of God and the boys understood the difference and believed in the Lord Jesus Christ. No one can take that away from them even if they are made to stay in the LDS church.
        
        Mormon Madness
        Exposed: the Bible vs. the Book of Mormon
        
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e49POJrQv2I&feature=related
        
        Now, just to let you know that I have given you all the information you need and will not be responding to your false evil beliefs since they are NOT of the one and only true God of the Bible.
      - Esther
        
        No one will make anyone "stay" where they don't want to "stay," Mr. Allen. If your assessment is totally right, obviously they have found another place to "stay." I really don't take your word for the word of God. You seem to be a person who accepts philosophies of men rather than of God in terms of what your knowledge is of the Mormons. So be it. In my estimation, that's puts you in a category far below the kingdom of God from my perspective in the true church of Jesus Christ.
littledove517

Can a true born again Christian vote for a Muslim? It happened and nothing was done about during the four years he has been in office. It has nothing to with racism for Obama is as much white as he is black, and if the US wants to get away from racism why is the color of a black person always compared with the color of white. You do not hear, "Well it was a Chinese American who won the gold", or any other color. As long as color is brought out there will always be a problem with the black's an white's. You do know that all the different colors in America have a homeland of their own that they can return to at any time if they do not like it here. The only ones who do not have a homeland to return to, and the ones who complain the least or the Native American's who land was taken from them, and then others want to complain about their life. I am sick of hearing about the color of ones skin, for no one can do anything about, but learn to live with it, and live together. Okay. Can a true born again Christian vote for a Catholic? It happened and not much was said. The are also a form of cult for they got the ideal of a virgin Mary from the Babylon goddess Semiramis who became the Queen of Babylon and married Nimrod. Historically he was called the husband of his mother. After Noah's flood, the survivors multiplied and built the great city of Babylon. Semiramis and Nimrod cane up with the idea of confessionals, and celibacy for the priesthood. Nimrod was called by many names including "Moloch." Babies were sacrificed in his honor. When Nimrod was put death, the people wept. Semiramis moved quickly to take advantage of the situation. Satan's phony virgin gave birth to another child and claimed that Nimrod had been reincarnated. The child was called. Tammuz. He became the sun god, Baal. She became a goddess with many names such as Baalti, (The Madonna), the Great Goddess Mother, Queen of Heaven, The Mediatrix, The Mother of Mankind, Astarte, Etc. As time went on, monuments of the goddess and her child appeared in many nation….because when the people of Babylon were scattered to various parts of the earth, they took with them the worship of the diving mother and child. Satan had successfully set up his own deadly religion long before Jesus was born…The earth was in darkness. "Even in Tibet, China, and Japan, the Jesuit missionaries were astonished to find the counterpart of Madonna and her child as devoutly worshipped as in papal Rome itself." (page 20, The Two Babylons, by Hislop.) It been recorded that even in Africa the Great Mother and child received divine honors. Worldwide, the adoration was so strong among the pagans that they would not forsake their mother goddess. ("Legacy of Rome" by Cyril Bailey page. 245). When Roman Catholicism came into existence around 300 A.D., the leaders knew if they could adopt the worship of the goddess mother into their religious system…then countless pagans would convert to Catholicism. But who could replace the Great Mother of paganism? Mary, the mother of Jesus was the only logical person. Little by little the worship of the pagan goddess was transferred to Mary. The ancient Babylonian religion depicted the goddess mother as the only one who could control her son. So the same satanic idea was incorporated into Catholicism. The "Mother of God" that Catholics worship is not the Mary of the Bible. Satan has successfully deceived them into worshipping his counterfeit goddess. "The Queen of Heaven." For Mary cannot intercede for you. Only Jesus is our Mediator. Mary can't answer your prayers. Only Jesus and His Father. Mary isn't the Queen of Heaven. Only Jesus is the King of heaven. God does not play tricks on people, Satan does. Mary was not sinless for the word of the living God says, "For ALL have sinned and come short of the glory of God." Did God lie? Mary was a sinner as we all are, and Jesus died for her as He did for the whole world. Mary cannot pray us into heaven, and she is not the way to heaven, for Jesus said, "I am the way the truth and the life, no one comes to Father except through Me." Not His mother, not the Pope, not the Priest, only Jesus. Jesus is our Great High Priest and we have no need for any other. We are to confess our sins to the Lord not to a man-made priest. So America put a Catholic in as President of the U.S.A. One who is a cult and prays to a piece of stone, and reads from the Catholic Bible. The Word is Jesus, and He is all we need.
Can a true born again Christian vote for a Mormon? All three are some kind of cult, and have their own Bible, and they all three will go with their own version of their Bible before standing firm in the Word of the living God. The Mormons do not pray to a piece of stone, and they have their many false, but I had rather have a Mormon for President than a Muslim. Muslim bow to a moon god they call Allah and then try to tell me he is the same God as mine. My God is a knowing God. He is a loving God, and He gave so that I might live. Allah is not a knowing god, and he wants the people to give to him. Ask a Muslim how much Allah loves them, and they will say, "We cannot ask Allah such a question, he will let us know when we go to Paradise." I had rather have neither. Christians are to do the best they can with what they have, and if we sit back and do nothing and put a pagan back in office knowing what he believes in then that would be a sin. The Mormon's do believe in the living God, not some god in the moon, and they do believe in Jesus and that He died for their salvation. So should a Christian vote for a pagan who tells us the Quran is better then the Bible, or someone who at least believes in the living God though in a different way. The living God tells us in His word that He uses all things, and that He works all things according to His will, and maybe Obama may win. If so I would say that God is using Him to work out His plans for the end times. Either way His word tells us "Let every soul be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and the authorities that exist are appointed by God" (Romans 13:1). So God uses mankind, (Christians and non-Christian's) to accomplish His will. I will not knowing sin against the living God, by putting someone in office who is a pagan worshiper. Israel did this several times, and each time they paid dearly for it, for they fell into worshiping the false god, god's, and turned from the living God.
- Bighoss
  
  Breaking news(!!!) just for you.
  
  The president is NOT a Muslim!
  
  And YOU are not a rational person!
Patricia

Does the dolt who wrote this dribble know that "Mormons" (correctly identified as members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints) ARE Christians? ("Mormon" was ancient prophet who kept ancient records that became part of The Book of Mormon in 1832, when Joseph Smith translated them.) Thus the name of JESUS CHRIST in the name???? That is:someone who follows Christ=a CHRISTIAN!!! I converted 8 years ago TODAY and have never know a better group of human being ANYWHERE! Are they human and mess up all the time? Of course, they are people, just like you. However, MOST of them try far more diligently to continue to improve & follow the ways of the Lord, everyday. YOU (each of you) should investigate, as I did. You will not be sorry. You will, however, need to open your heart & particularly your brain, to understand the depth of this church. Good luck on your journey.
Patricia

You are completely incorrect, Bret. The name of the church is The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. A Christian is someone who follows Christ, thus, as His name is included in the title, we are most definitely Christian. We do not worship several gods, we worship one God, creator of all life, and His son Jesus Christ. I investigated this church just over 8 years ago, for several months and TODAY is the 8th anniversary of my "card carrying" membership. (The "card" is my Temple Recommend, which allows me to enter any LDS Temple in the world, all 132 of them, and experience the most peaceful place that exists on the planet. One must live a clean life, follow the Word of Wisdom, pay a full 10% tithing and perform a "calling" (work to do) at all times. It is the best decision I ever made and I would encourage you to investigate it for yourself. Find out the truth and stop printing information of which you no nothing about. The best of luck to you and your family in your quest for the truth.
PFG

Far as I can tell Mormons are Christians:
http://mormon.org/what-do-mormons-believe/
Right on the front of the page there it says:
"Jesus Christ, Our Savior
Jesus Christ is the Son of God and the (ours and yours) Savior of the world. His life and teachings are the way to peace and happiness."
Now generally speaking & I know I'm right If you accept Jesus Christ as your lord & savior by golly you're a Christian. With the exception of whatever Unitarianism is about, & there can only be one image to make one of there's no rainbows involved.
http://mormon.org/jesus-christ
- Bar-Eliam
  
  Another dead-eyed staring blankly and with a straight face makes statement supporting a false religions and making false statements.
  I would take Unitarians over a moron/mormon any-day. At least they are allowed to read books about other religions and cultures.
  - PFG
    
    http://mormon.org/jesus-christ "false statements"? It would seem Unitarians are allowed to do just about anything, not much of a Religion.
David

Can a Christian vote for a Mormon? Short answer …. NO.

I hope I don't have to go through all the scriptures which indicate the God is sovereign and it is He who raises up kings (or presidents) and it is He who brings them down. From eternity past God has determined who will win the 2012 presidential election. If he has determined that Barak Obama will win, then he will win even if I compromise and vote for Mit Romney. If he has determined that Mit Romney will win, then we will do so without my vote. Christians who vote for Mr. Romney are damaging their credibility in the community for the sake of expediency.

My prayers for this election are two fold. First: I am praying that one of the third parties will produce a candidate that I can vote for without compromising what I believe are the biblical standards for a civil magistrate. Second: I am praying that God will be merciful to our nation and bring down this Godless, wicked, and blasphemous administration.
Dave Fiorini

Mormons are good hard working people. The kind of people we need in America. Not the ones with there hand out for freebes all of the time.
sgt York

By all means we can vote for a Mormon,look at the number of Christians who voted for a Muslim. Vote R/R
sohail khan

Can any Christian vote for a person who openly supports and promotes gay marriage and does not even like the word God and can not support the traditional marriage between a man and women. We can certainly support anyone who proclaims that Jesus is his personal Saviour. Therefore, the choice is clear, we should support Mitt Romney!
- Bar-Eliam
  
  Perhaps you might notice in your readings here that Moromney does NOT proclaim that Jesus is his personal Savior.
  He worships another Jesus…the brother of Satin.
John Adams

Frankly, neither obama nor romney are truly Christians. If you doubt that, read your Bible and see what it means to be a Christian.
Can a Christian vote for a mormon. Certainly, they can and may, but I don't believe they should.
Christians should vote for men who honor God, His Holy Word and live a life in obedience to His commands. Neither obama nor romney fit this bill.
BJ Philipp

Obama acts like a muslim, smells like a muslim and he is muslim from pass speeches around the world. He hates Chistians as a whole. Any Christan who votes for Obama and Dem party need to check their belief in Lord Jesus Christ. I agree with Ted.
- Bar-Eliam
  
  How long have you been a practicing Luddite?
fatal42

Oppose to voting for a Muslum what else can they do ??? The Muslum in the WH MUST be removed !!
KERRY STEPHENS

Barak HUSSEIN Obama is a muslim, quit saying that he is a Christian. I would rather vote for a Mormon than a muslim
- Bighoss
  
  Predictably you, together with a large number of other duped and deranged contributors to this thread, have eructed the nonsense that the President of the United States and Commander in Chief of Her Armed Forces, the HONORABLE Barack Hussein Obama, is a Muslim (of, as one of the illiterati on here has spelled it. a "muslum").
  
  History will record, and future readers of history will be astonished, that something like 20 percent of Americans in our time actually harbored such a delusion. Future eyes will roll and future jaws will drop when those future readers of history learn how deeply and ignorantly this
  absurd notion penetrated into the thinking of otherwise seemingly sane and normal people.
  
  The late H.L. Mencken described this kind of phenomenon well when he wrote of "the virulence of the national appetite for bogus revelation."
  - Bar-Eliam
    
    These are not seemingly sane and normal people. I do know several people who will not be voting for President Obama but certainly not because he is a Muslim nor because he is of mixed parentage.
    The real topper here amongst posters who are no longer celebrated as members of our society continue to call those who follow Islam….Muslins. Now I have a lot of Muslin upstairs and it has not killed anyone. I find these people nothing more than a bunch of brainwashed parrots.
    By the way, they forget that President Bush also held Ramadan dinners during his term and also Yom Kippur dinners. We have even attended Easter Egg rolls on the lawn at the Whitehouse.
    What IS this world coming to?
http://twitter.com/KennDillon Silver Haired Saint

I am a very conservative Christian and I try to walk out my life following the guidelines set out by the Bible. Most days I fail, but God is good and He is faithful to forgive my sins when I confess them to him and ask for repentance. I am also a strict constructionist when it comes to The Constitution of the United States of America. I am a Navy Veteran and I attend a very Biblically solid Assembly of God Church with a Marine Veteran Pastor. If the doors are opened I try to be there. I say all this to give you a bit of an idea where I come from.

This question (can I vote for a Mormon) troubled me early in the election process, but through prayer and study and hard teaching I am of the belief that if I were to vote for Obama, I would be in error and therefor in sin.

I am challenged by Mr. Romney's Mormonism and Mr. Ryan's Catholicism; however, both of these men exhibit greater moral integrity in their pinky fingers than the Muschriluistianm currently living at 1600 Pennsylvania Ave.

I believe it is our duty as Christians to vote for Romney and Ryan and a failure to vote is a serious lack of responsibility and a failure to vote for them would be sin.

It is not a time to sit home and complain and leave it up to everyone else–we are everyone else. Get off you posterior and get to the polls and do your responsibility to this great nation and vote–for Romney & Ryan.

2 Chronicles 7:14
Dust it off and look it up–hint it is the 14th book in the Old Testament.
- Bar-Eliam
  
  Just remember the OT is no longer valid.
  We also must adjust for your evaluation and thinking as your church is another cult founded by good old Amy Simpleton. It is filled with errors as are t he biblical interpretations you are taught.
  Too bad.
petroskhan

You know, I had thought that I would vote for Romney. But events over the last couple of days have shown me that this would be wrong, and something I cannot do. Discussions with Mormons have shown me that they are disingenuous, deceitful, and hate-filled in the extreme.

I'm going to vote for Ron Paul. At least HE'S not blatantly worshiping Satan.
- agbjr
  
  Your comment is frankly asinine and you are obviously a disingenuous "Christian".
  - petroskhan
    
    My comment is the result of the actions of others in reply to simple questions being met with avoidance, hostility and insults. And since you don't know me, you don't know squat about my faith. Unless you're a Mormon, then of course you know that I'm not, and that's all the excuse for hatred you need.
    
    But thank you, and have a nice day.
    - agbjr
      
      Your attitude toward members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints is not only un-American it is frankly un-Christian. You have been called out by an ordained Presbyterian Elder.
      - petroskhan
        
        "Un-American"? LOLOLOL
        
        Un-AMERICAN? Oh, okay…let me get this straight…Mormons now represent AMERICA? Not agreeing with that phony Joseph Smith is somehow being against America? Stop, please, before you make me hurt myself laughing…
        
        "…it is frankly un-Christian." Really? How's that? Joseph Smith was a fraud. He was no prophet, since he fails the test of the Bible like every cult founder (Ellen White, for example), he taught anti-Biblical blasphemies…I could go on an on. But you know all that as well as I do.
        
        And as for being "called out", well, let's be honest here. I've done the calling out, but received no answers to simple questions. I've asked people for their thoughts on a subject and gotten nothing in return but misdirection, dissembling, and insults.
        
        Who's being "un-Christian" here?
Ethan

True believers are in a theocratic monarchy called the Kingdom of Christ where leaders are appointed, not voted in by popularity, so the question above is moot. Do you think the Kingdom is not now? What about these then:

Heb 12:22 "But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to myriads of angels."

Col 1:13,14 "For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son, in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins."

Mat 6:10 "Your kingdom come. Your will be done, On earth as it is in heaven."

Mat 12:28 "But if I cast out demons by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God has come upon you."

Mat 16:28 "Truly I say to you, there are some of those who are standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom."
Ron

I'm not voting for a religion! I'm voting for someone who supports the Constitution. Thus far, the Obama administration has shown a huge desire to destroy Christianity and Judaism. If the fear is Mormonism is going to take over, Romney has said, like Kennedy the Church doesn't run the government, the Constitution does! I have no problem voting for a Mormon and not an individual using religion as a guise to influence people.
agbjr

Here we go again with this crap! Never mind the person's religious affiliations it is the Constitution and OUR Republic that is at stake here. If a Constitution-abiding fiscally conservative MUSLIM was running I would vote for him! Many of these so-called "Christians" questioning Romney's religion sound just like the holier-than-thou Bible-thumpers who insisted electing Roman Catholic Jack Kennedy meant the Pope would dictate the federal government policies. Grow up, get educated and stop embarrassing yourselves by displaying your ignorance … start acting as an American AND a Christian.
Buddy

I will admit to being uncomfortable with a Mormon president because I am convinced from experience that Mormonism is a cult but at least we know what we are getting. I do believe that Obama is 1) Not a Christian 2) Anti-America 3) Socialist in the strictest definition of the word 4) broken many Federal and Constitutional laws in the name of Socialism…the end justifies the means 5) Has no problem lying like I have never heard before in my life as well as the entire Liberal elite establishment. VOTE OR SIT ON THE SIDELINES AND SUFFER!!
cudlow

NO! NO! NO! the lesser of two evils is still evil and these two are equally evil! I am writing in Jesus Christ for president this year!
- agbjr
  
  Your comment is frankly asinine. Any write-in or non-vote is a vote FOR Obama and another Obama term along with a socialist Democrat majority congress will bring an end to YOUR religious freedom. Wake up, discard your ignorance, and vote for Romney.
Cynthia

Obama is a "theologically liberal Christian", a "left-leaning Christian"? Ummm, NO!! He only gave God lip service in 2008 to attract more voters. He's the furthest thing from a Christian you can be! He supports abortion at ANY stage of pregnancy, even voting three times to allow babies to die if they survive an abortion! He has tried to wipe away all traces of God in all his venues! He embraces gay "marriage"! He supports redistribution of wealth, which is unbiblical. When his mouth is open, he's lying! His entire life story is a fabrication!! Christian?? Just who is the author trying to snow? Obama is governed by an evil spirit if not Lucifer himself! He's the antithesis of Christianity!! The Bible says we shall know them by their fruits, and his are rotting and stinking up the entire place!!! he's either a Muslim or a Black Liberation Theologist like his buddy Reverend Wright, Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson, but a Christian?!! Absolutely NOT!!! As a Christian I will vote for Romney just to get rid of this blot on our history!
http://profiles.yahoo.com/u/QHRUML5XFH7AMSWH63TQH7F7E4 MalikTous

What is it about the name 'Church of Jesus Christ of the Latter Day Saints' that escapes Christians? That said, I know the LDS church has historic and current problems, though not much different from other Christian sects. If Romney becomes absolutely necessary to implement the removal and exile of Borkup Obummer, then a vote for 'Moroni Mitt' would be justified. Otherwise, there are Libertarians, Greens, and Independents on most states' ballots.
marineh2ominer

Christians are people that believe that JESUS CHRIST is our savior for having bore the punishment for OUR sins under GODS law . There are MANY denominations of Christians , these include Mormans along with Baptists , Methodists , Prysbetarians , Amish , Mennonite ,etc: etc: etc : , Why would Christians not vote for him ? It was not a problem when the first Catholic Christian , John Kennedy was elected . The only ones making hay with this garbage is the heinous and destructive MSM in their support for the progressive lunatic they foisted on us in the first place .
- Bar-Eliam
  
  Don't impune Real Christians with the false Christians of which Mormons are certainly one.
Chris

One fictional cult voting for another fictional cult? What a hypocritical joke. Mormonism is truly bad science fiction. Christianity is about as bad because it cannot agree on what it is. The Book of Mormon is clearly junk fiction.

Romeny and Ryan are plutocratic, misogynistic, homophobic, Ayn Randian, theocratic sock puppets that will do anything to please their rich backers and do nothing for anybody else.

They are just banking on the religious and racist to get sucked up into their scam.
- Bar-Eliam
  
  "They are just banking on the religious and racists to get sucked up into their scam"
  Looks pretty much like they are doing a tremendous job.
jtn

A better headline question to ask might be, "Can Christians vote for a Protest-ant?" Scour your bibles…protesting to leave one church and start one in your own image is the furthest thing from "biblical" or "Christ-like".
http://www.facebook.com/jim.schafer.355 Jim Schafer

I feel that since Jehovah used Pharaoh, Nebuchadnezer, and several other non-believers to perform His will and they played a significant role in the children of Israel's success as a nation, that He can and still uses, non-believers to do so still today. He can use a Mormon as well as a Muslim or any other religion to perform His will. It is our role as believers to know what the Biblical principles are, and to discern which candidate parallels with most, if not all, those principles are then we will have a clearer perspective as to how to cast our ballot.
- Kronae
  
  What do you know about the cultic mormons?
Winston

The following applicable scriptures should be "required reading" for all professed Christian voters:
II Corinthians 6:17-18
II Corinthians 6:14
Deuteronomy 22:10
John 15:19
James 4:4
bwheeler

Can Christians vote for a Mormon? Yes. Much more so than a Hypocrite or an atheist. You will know them by the fruit they bear, not by the title they proclaim and if you have studied Romney's life you know he has helped others in so many ways – even cooking, himself, and taking food to the sick..
Ron

This a stupid premise! We are not voting for a Religion! We are voting to regain America from a Marxist/Communist, before it's too late!
http://www.facebook.com/people/Peter-Chvostovsky/100002587935710 Peter Chvostovsky

I am a Christian and have thought on this ; to vote or not to vote. For many not to vote is akin to blasphemy! Who is really in control of this Nation. How come candidates are at BUILTERBERG meetings or the BOHEMIAN GROVE , THEN BECOME THE PRESIDENTS? Has abortion or sodomy been outlawed? NO. Instead things are becoming progressively more and more immoral. Are God's people more concerned with voting out the president that they will vote for anyone. What would happen if God's people turn from their wicked ways, seek God's face, cry out in prayer to Him: answer; He will hear from heaven, forgive their sin and heal the land. If not, the sword (war) is coming upon the land. 2Chron.7:14… I think it is high time to trust the Lord Jesus Christ with all our heart and give up on this evil world system. Whether capitalism, communism, dictators, natzi, Islam or the popes; the prince of this world is Satin. Eph.2:1-4. This is how the LORD has ordained it. Rom.13. We as Christians need to look for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God. Heb.11:10; Rev.21. CHOOSING RATHER TO SUFFER AFFLICTION WITH THE PEOPLE OF GOD,THAN TO ENJOY THE PLEASURES OF SIN FOR A SEASON; ESTEEMING THE REPROACH OF CHRIST GREATER RICHES THAN THE TREASURES IN EGYPT: FOR HE HAD RESPECT UNTO THE RECOMPENSE OF THE REWARD. HEB.11:25,26 His servant, Chaplain Peter
- Lurl
  
  Obviously you are just another putz ripping off innocent but very dumb people who would pay attention to anything you state about a bull crap religion?
  There are real religions in this world and yours isn't one of them.
  What is a builterberg? You can't even get the name right how stupid are you. Check out the Grove and see who goes there. Romney? Ryan? Bushes? Kissinger? We could go on but then since you are not a member of the Skull and Bones guess you won't be invited soon.
  Well gotta go this is a great golf day and we have a great TEE time.
Zardos

Obama is not a Christian.