Pope believes Christianity will rekindle in Europe

Pope Benedict XVI granted a rare interview to the creators of a documentary in which he said that he is “convinced” that “there will also be a new springtime for Christianity” in Europe.

The bishops, experts and observers at the synod on the New Evangelization were treated to a screening of the new documentary at the Oct. 15 afternoon session.

“(T)he desire for God…is profoundly inscribed into each human soul and cannot disappear. Certainly we can forget God for a time … but God never disappears,” Pope Benedict said on screen, though he was not in the audience. “This restlessness … is an expression of the hope that man may, ever and anew … start to journey towards this God.”

The movie, entitled “Bells of Europe: A Journey into the Faith in Europe,” considers Christianity, European culture, and the future of the continent. In addition to the Pope, it features interviews with leaders of the other main Christian confessions in Europe, as well as leaders in politics and culture.

Continue reading at www.dfwcatholic.org

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http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=58215905 Wesley Woods

St. Augustine stated that our hearts are restless until we find ourselves in Jesus Christ. with the different European nations watching their economies flying to the physical cliff the citizens have to look for something other than money to find stability. as the Roman Empire was crumbling St. Augustine wrote his book The City of God arguing that the empire was crumbling because of its pagan roots and not from Christianity. St. Patrick was working to train missionaries to return to the continent to share the good news of Jesus Christ and his Kingdom which has no end. the church has the answer to the problems that the world faces. all the church needs to do is be the church of Jesus Christ. for there is ONE HOLY CATHOLIC AND APOSTOLIC CHURCH.
- Despeville
  
  Catholic is not the same as ROMAN Catholic or any other rite you would like to place before the word "Catholic". Not in a sense of a name, not is a sense of history and definitively not in the sense of the deposit of Christian faith – The Word of God itself.
  - http://www.facebook.com/jasper.heath Jasper Heath
    
    Catholic MEANS universal. Not the isolated, provincial sect you belong to. The marks of the Catholic Church are that it is One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic. These are the identifiers which make It unique throughout all Christendom. We KNOW what we believe. You guys make up your own minds and can't agree among yourselves. That's better known as Absolute Confusion and Anarchy. I'll stay Catholic, all the same, thanks, since It alone has proven Itself to be the only Church which Christ and the Holy Ghost established at Pentecost. And still stands today, AGAINST ALL ODDS, wouldn't you agree?
    
    And our headquarters is in Rome, where St. Peter's Basilica stands directly over the bones and grave of St. Peter, who lies in the catycombs containing all the burial sites of the victims of the Roman emperors like Caligula who spent themselves out trying to annihilate us. And lost.
    
    Like Cardinal George who was looking wistfully out over the courtyard at the Roman Circus still there in Rome, and was asked what he was musing about. He answered, "Well, there was the Roman emperor's best example of power and now where is he? And right now I'm standing next to the Vicar of Christ, the Holy Roman Pontiff, Pope Benedict, 2,000 years of a line of Popes after the Roman Empire and I KNOW we're still here!"
    
    Come home. We're Superman, Indestructible!
    - petroskhan
      
      Proverbs 16:18
      "Pride goes before destruction, And a haughty spirit before stumbling."
      - Despeville
        
        I would also add as a commentary that: "a pointy hat on a head points to a pointy spirit inside."
      - petroskhan
        
        LOL
    - Despeville
      
      Deeply deluded poor soul. I have been in your Roman Catholic religion more than I care to remember I have priests in my family and they are just as clueless about the Gospel as you are. I have seen your popes in person and there is nothing you can tell me that I do not know about your Roman religion. Yes ROMAN Catholic and not Catholic only which is an oxymoron in itself and so symptomatic for your damning religion of works. There is no "Vicar" of Christ. That is as damnable heresy as your saved Muslim brothers in faith claim is which you do not even know about to be on the books of your Roman cult or as your Roman idol of Mary being "Co Redemptrix" with Chirst. You have been fooled and sold at whole sale price to satan himself. Now educate yourself about your very own religion of satan and your home is hell with him:
      
      "841 The Church's relationship with the Muslims. "The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind's judge on the last day."
      
      Point 841 of the Catechism of the Roman Catholic "church"
      Vatican Link: http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/__P29.HTM
      
      969"This motherhood of Mary in the order of grace continues uninterruptedly from the consent which she loyally gave at the Annunciation and which she sustained without wavering beneath the cross, until the eternal fulfilment of all the elect. Taken up to heaven she did not lay aside this saving office but by her manifold intercession continues to bring us the gifts of eternal salvation …. Therefore the Blessed Virgin is invoked in the Church under the titles of Advocate, Helper, Benefactress, and Mediatrix."
      
      Point 969 of the Catechism of the Roman Catholic "church"
      
      Vatican Link: http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/__P2C.HTM
      
      Now go and along with Muslims adore the one, merciful God which by the way already happens in Roman Catholic countries in Europe where Roman Catholic priests on special days "adore the one, merciful God " with Muslim clerics visiting Romish "churches"… As if Marian idolatry was not blasphemous enough.
petroskhan

Just out of curiosity, what on earth would the pope know about Christianity?

That pompous pagan fool is nothing more than the figurehead for the greatest threat to the Word of Christ this world has ever seen.

It deeply sickens me when so many equate Christianity with that pagan, satanic organization in Rome.
- http://www.facebook.com/jasper.heath Jasper Heath
  
  Except for the historical fact that the Catholic Church is indestructible. No matter what the world has thrown at Her for 2,000 years. Recall?
  - petroskhan
    
    Yes, one should never underestimate the might of Satan. Thank you for pointing that out.
    - http://www.facebook.com/jasper.heath Jasper Heath
      
      Actually satan's greatest tactic is to divide and conquer, which he has done with expert intelligence in dividing the PROTEST-and sects into over 38,000 different, vying, disagreeing, contentious and theologically confused organizations, which go through perversion after perversion, heresy after heresy and not one of you can wake up to be amazed that you are all in disagreement. We, on the other hand, are astounded how we agree with the Apostles whose teachings our Faith is based on both today and 2,000 years ago. One, solid, unchanged, pure Faith.
      
      Compare that with the fate of PROTEST-antism. Now THAT'S "the greatest threat to the Word of Christ this world has ever seen." We wrote the Bible, defined It and live according to It and the Holy Traditions handed down through 2,000 years of the Magisterium's teaching. It is explicitly proven by history. Not the rewritten history of your arrogant PROTEST-ant "historians," but by the unfailing Truth of the only Organization which has seen it all, the One, Holy, Roman and Apostolic Catholic Church. We're still here, where will you be without sufficient oil in your lamp, having extracted yourself from the Sacraments? http://www.olrl.org/doctrine/eens2.shtml
      - petroskhan
        
        Brother, you are lost, and I hope you can find your way back.
        
        Yes, the RCC is here, and has been for some time. Big deal. What does that prove? Wiccans, Druids, Buddhists and Odinists have been around longer. Does that lend their ridiculous claims sort of validity? Does that make them right? I'm thinking "No", but you might have another answer. Next point, if you have one?
        
        And just to be clear, the Catholic church is a whore. It has taken on every sort of pagan and/or blasphemous practice it thought might increase the size of its bank accounts. If you have a Bible, I would advise you to read it, and then compare it to the doctrines of the RCC, and statements by various popes throughout history.
        
        "We wrote the Bible, defined It". Really? Wow, I've been wrong for so long. All these years, I've been foolishly thinking that GOD wrote the Bible, through the inspiration He gave to the prophets. Imagine how silly I feel, believing something so ridiculous. And you "defined It"? Really? God didn't do that, either? He needed your pagan organization to handle that for Him?
        
        And I'd be very careful claiming that you live by the Bible, if you're claiming to be catholic. That, my friend, is a contradiction in terms of a mind-boggling magnitude.
      - Despeville
        
        He ain't your brother for his father is not your Father…
      - petroskhan
        
        You may be right…his father is in Rome…Mine holds a higher office.
      - Despeville
        
        Indeed. As to this: "We wrote the Bible, defined It". Next time ask the papist how much of Old Testament they wrote… Hhahahahahhaha Not they wrote a zilch of a New Testament. This type of a shiboleth is one of the dumbest and most arrogant and anachronistic lies Romish "church" is using to fool fools like Jasper.
      - petroskhan
        
        One lie among a great many. But then what would one expect of the embodiment of John 8:44?
        "You are of your father the devil, and you want to do the desires of
        your father. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in
        the truth because there is no truth in him. Whenever he speaks a lie,
        he speaks from his own nature, for he is a liar and the father of lies."
      - Despeville
        
        "841 The Church's relationship with the Muslims. "The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind's judge on the last day."
        Point 841 of the Catechism of the Roman Catholic "church"
        Vatican Link: http://www.vatican.va/archive/…
        969"This motherhood of Mary in the order of grace continues uninterruptedly from the consent which she loyally gave at the Annunciation and which she sustained without wavering beneath the cross, until the eternal fulfilment of all the elect. Taken up to heaven she did not lay aside this saving office but by her manifold intercession continues to bring us the gifts of eternal salvation …. Therefore the Blessed Virgin is invoked in the Church under the titles of Advocate, Helper, Benefactress, and Mediatrix."
        Point 969 of the Catechism of the Roman Catholic "church"
        Vatican Link: http://www.vatican.va/archive/…
        Now go and along with Muslims adore the one, merciful God which by the way already happens in Roman Catholic countries in Europe where Roman Catholic priests on special days "adore the one, merciful God " with Muslim clerics visiting Romish "churches"… As if Marian idolatry was not blasphemous enough.
      - Despeville
        
        "the PROTEST-and sects into over 38,000 different, vying, disagreeing, contentious and theologically confused organizations"
        
        Hahahhaah how dumb you can be? You sure it is not 30,000 as in "World Christian Encyclopedia ? Which by the way includes all kinds of spiritists JWs etc. By the way as I explained to other dumbed down Romish victims before… Do you even realize that same source on same page states that there are also 242 Romish denominations Do you realize that same source of this outlandish nonsensical number 2001 World Christian Encyclopedia, published by Oxford University Press states that Roman religion is responsible for 5 MILLION DEATHS of believers it persecuted? Quote those numbers too papist since now you know them…
    - Jeff Dixon
      
      Let us also not underestimate the might of delusion. A real issue, as opposed to the delusion of Satan.
      - petroskhan
        
        Well, yes, delusion is a real issue, and dangerous. But we're talking about the pope right now, not evolution.
      - Jeff Dixon
        
        We are talking about delusion, not scientific facts.
      - petroskhan
        
        We are talking about the pope, not science fiction.
  - Despeville
    
    Your ROMISH church is a seat of satan and for at least 1500 years that does make it "indestructible" but only long in talons of satan:
    
    "841 The Church's relationship with the Muslims. "The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind's judge on the last day."Point 841 of the Catechism of the Roman Catholic "church"
    Vatican Link: http://www.vatican.va/archive/…969"This motherhood of Mary in the order of grace continues uninterruptedly from the consent which she loyally gave at the Annunciation and which she sustained without wavering beneath the cross, until the eternal fulfilment of all the elect. Taken up to heaven she did not lay aside this saving office but by her manifold intercession continues to bring us the gifts of eternal salvation …. Therefore the Blessed Virgin is invoked in the Church under the titles of Advocate, Helper, Benefactress, and Mediatrix."Point 969 of the Catechism of the Roman Catholic "church"Vatican Link: http://www.vatican.va/archive/…Now go and along with Muslims adore the one, merciful God which by the way already happens in Roman Catholic countries in Europe where Roman Catholic priests on special days "adore the one, merciful God " with Muslim clerics visiting Romish "churches"… As if Marian idolatry was not blasphemous enough.
  - Jeff Dixon
    
    It is not a historical fact. It is something we have seen only over the last 2,000 years. Which is blimp in actual history. And we are now seeing people move away from religion given that for the first time ever, people are not being killed for saying they do not believe.
- http://www.facebook.com/people/Andrew-Patton/592034163 Andrew Patton
  
  What doctrines does the Catholic Church teach contrary to the Church that was persecuted by the pagan emperors of Rome? Name them, if you can. If you cannot, then confess that we are the same Catholic Church today as was persecuted by pagan Rome.
  - petroskhan
    
    Not sure what you're asking. Could you be more specific? It seems like you're asking me what doctrines of the Catholic church run contrary to the Bible…is that right?
- Jeff Dixon
  
  A threat to the entire world is what Christianity or any religion promotes.
  - petroskhan
    
    Depends on your definition of Christian.
    
    You paint with a broad brush, lumping all claimants together. In that view, yes, much harm has been done paying lip service, claiming to be "christian" to further their own selfish goals.
    
    I, however, and any true Christian, I would imagine, define "Christian" with a bit more focus. To be a Christian is to attempt, to the best of one's abilities, to follow the guidelines of Christ. To walk the walk, not just talk the talk.
    
    I'm sure that once again, if asked, you will state that Hitler was a Christian. One of your favorite examples of how bad Christianity is for the world. But aside from him claiming to be, do we see any actions of his that would lead us to speculate that he was a Christian, had he not claimed to be one? Or would he seem to be a heartless, godless monster, hell-bent on world domination? Leave his claims aside, and examine his life, actions and goals. That is, after all, the way to determine a man's nature, isn't it? And let's not forget the words of Jesus Himself, "The one saying, I have known Him, and not keeping His commandments is a liar, and the truth is not in that one." (1 John 2:4)
    
    I understand you viewpoint. Lots of claims, lots of harm. But how many claimants actually follow the rules they claim to support? How many of these "Christians" that have done so much harm have actually conducted themselves in a Christian fashion. You know the Bible fairly well, Jeff. Many atheist do (The better to eat you with, my dear!).
    
    Apply that knowledge, then, to the question of whether or not the harm done in the NAME of Christianity was done BY Christianity.
    - Jeff Dixon
      
      First off, I said Christianity or any religion. I was not just singling out Christianity. The Muslims are much more violent today than Christians are. In some ways Christianity has tempered itself, but that is primarily because people and governments no longer give it unfettered power over their lives.
      
      I also do not point to Hitler as an example of how bad Christianity is for the world. I point out that he called himself a Christian and the Catholic church never too issue with him or his barbaric actions when people attempt to say he was an Atheist.
      
      But what I find most interesting is your comment about the actions of a true Christian. Since all Christian groups believe themselves to be the "true Christians", and they believe other Christian sects are wrong, there is nothing to support your view that the way you perceive Christianity is, in fact, the correct way to view it.
      
      And the reality is that Jesus is also a barbaric monster as depicted in the bible. How anyone can read the book of Revelation and come away from it with a perspective that Jesus is a loving and kind guy is nothing short of a miracle.
      - petroskhan
        
        So many interesting things in there, I hope I can cover all of them…
        
        First off, I wonder if you might define "Christianity" and/or "Christian" for the sake of discussion. It will make future comments more on target and germane.
        
        Next, my way of defining a Christian is whether or not he follows what is written in the Bible, without bringing in outside rationales, "interpretation", etc. If one believes in what the Bible says, then one should follow the Book which is the basis for the alleged belief. It's the same as someone saying that he is a firm supporter of, and believer in, communism…and he owns multiple properties, works in advertising, and summers in the Mediterranean.
        
        I would love to hear how you feel that the Jesus you believe is described in the Bible is a "barbaric monster." I do believe that He is loving and kind…but I'm curious as to your interpretation of what you've read.
      - Jeff Dixon
        
        I would call a Christian someone who believes that Jesus died for their sins and is their only way to eternal life.
        
        Why is Jesus a monster as depicted in Revelation?
        
        And he opened the pit of the abyss; and there went up a smoke out of the pit, as the smoke of a great furnace; and the sun and the air were darkened by reason of the smoke of the pit. 9:3And out of the smoke came forth locusts upon the earth; and power was given them, as the scorpions of the earth have power. 9:4And it was said unto them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree, but only such men as have not the seal of God on their foreheads. 9:5And it was given them that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when it striketh a man. 9:6And in those days men shall seek death, and shall in no wise find it; and they shall desire to die, and death fleeth from them.
      - petroskhan
        
        By that definition, Satan is a Christian. He knows that Jesus died for our sins, and he also knows the rules, so he would know that the only way to that eternal life is through Jesus. There are, according to your definition, no behavioral requirements, nor are there further obligations placed upon one other than those two acknowledgements?
        
        And as for your depiction of Jesus from Revelation, I am to suppose then that you would call it barbaric to lay down rules, clearly explain the consequences of disobedience to those rules, and then enact upon those who elected to disobey the very consequences they brought upon themselves?
        
        You would, I further assume, consider a parent spanking his children, if not a "barbaric monster", at the very least "barbaric"? Or just a monster? Or maybe just a bit sick in the head?
        
        Let's really look at this passage you've cited as proof of Jesus' being a "monster".
        
        Locusts (figurative, as given in later verses) are called upon to torment those who have elected to ignore God's rules, and turned their backs on Him. They are not killed, but "tormented" (in what ways is unclear) for 5 months. Further on in the chapter, other torments are given as well…with this rather sad observation, in the last two verses:
        "20 But
        the rest of mankind, who were not killed by these plagues, did not
        repent of the works of their hands, that they should not worship demons,
        and idols of gold, silver, brass, stone, and wood, which can neither
        see nor hear nor walk. 21 And they did not repent of their murders or their sorceries[b] or their sexual immorality or their thefts."
        
        So, even in the face of such heinous consequences for their misdeeds, there are some who still not repent. And to attempt to show them the error of their ways, and to bring upon them the punishment foretold eons ago as the consequence of that misbehavior, is "barbaric"? You can label it as such if it pleases you to do so, Jeff. I call it "justice". And a warning.
      - Jeff Dixon
        
        On what basis does Satan understand that Jesus is the way to eternal life? Even if he knows he will burn forever in the lake of fire, he will still exist forever in the lake. That is eternal life. Not a pleasant eternal life,, to be sure, but still eternal. And where does it say that Satan cannot renounce his evil ways and become a follower of Christ?
        
        The analogy of god as a good parent is tiresome. Good parents do not threaten their children with eternal torture as a way of keeping them in line. They do not set up impossible laws to follow. They do not punish their children for all eternity. They do not kill their kids. A parent encourages their children. They praise their children. A parent teaches a child how to live their life because one day the parent will not longer be around and the child needs to know how to function on their own. The biblical god does not do this. The biblical god says to mankind that we are worthless and cannot accomplish anything without god.
        
        You can consider someone who punishes people with eternal torture as wonderful, it is obvious you do. But I suspect you do not treat your own children this way and would lock up in jail anyone who actually does treat their kids this way.
      - petroskhan
        
        I think you need to go back and re-read the Bible a bit, Jeff. No offense meant by that, by the way. I do recognize that you are fairly knowledgeable on the Bible, but if one reads carefully, taking things in context, there is no eternal torment outlined in the Bible.
        
        The Bible frequently refers to those who are condemned as undergoing the "second death" and being annihilated, and deprived of eternal life. Eternal suffering, while unpleasant, is still living, and this is against the punishment of death (being the result of being cut off from God) which is the ultimate "reward" of those not found in the Book of Life.
        
        And as for those who choose to apply their understanding of what is "right" and "wrong" to God, for the sake of discussion assume that God does exist. He is our infinite superior, and His motivations and reasons far beyond our own. In that context, does it make sense to ascribe human understandings and motivations to something (someOne) that we can't fully understand? It's similar to a child wanting to why he can't have ice cream for breakfast, and not caring about the nonsensical explanation of sugar and teeth.
        
        So, I don't "consider someone who punishes people with eternal torture as wonderful", since I don't see that in the Bible. I see eternal punishment mentioned; death is pretty eternal, isn't it? And there is the passage about the smoke of the condemned's torment rising up for ever…doesn't say that they are being tormented forever.
        
        So I must still disagree with you that in any way does Christ resemble a "barbaric monster".
      - Jeff Dixon
        
        This passage from Revelation shows that the lost of the tribulation will be punished by eternal torment.
        
        "And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man
        worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his
        hand, The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out
        without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented
        with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the
        presence of the Lamb: And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever
        and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his
        image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name" (Revelation 14:9-11).
        
        The only way that their smoke can ascend up forever is if they are on fire and
        are not consumed by the flame.
      - petroskhan
        
        "The only way that their smoke can ascend up forever is if they are on fire and
        are not consumed by the flame."
        
        So, the smoke cannot exist without the flame? If I light a match, blow it out to get some smoke from it, and drop the match in the water, the smoke in the air disappears?
        
        There is no connection between the smoke rising forever, and the burning lasting forever, except in the minds of those who choose to incorrectly assume the existence of eternal torment, which is clear opposition to numerous other verses in the Bible.
      - Jeff Dixon
        
        An eternal smoke cannot exist without the flame. If you light a match, get some smoke and blow it out, the smoke does not automatically disappear, but it soon does dissipate. In order to keep the smoke occurring eternally, the flame must also be eternal.
      - petroskhan
        
        There is nothing in the verse about the smoke "occurring eternally"; it simply states, rather poetically, that the smoke will rise up forever. Up, up, and away…
      - Jeff Dixon
        
        You are ignoring the rest of the verse which states "and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name":
        
        How can they have no rest if they have been eliminated from existence?
      - petroskhan
        
        "How can they have no rest if they have been eliminated from existence?"
        Not sure, actually. Perhaps it's a reference to set period of torment prior to receiving the "second death"; perhaps it's a reference to the "rest" from sin, worry and death that the saved will receive as their reward. I will certainly look into, though.
        
        But multiple other verses in the Bible are quite clear as to nature of this "second death". It's an eternal cutting off from the power of God, without which life is impossible.
      - Esther
        
        Jeff, I look at all these stories same as I see the fax machine template on my word software. I open up the various ones and find usually the one that uses less ink because ink is expensive and then I chose it, and fit my text into the format. Now that is a bit of simplification, but the point is every story I know — and I NEVER heard one in all my years as a Catholic about the woman who committed adultery, for example — we only used the most interesting and the less complicated ones over and over. Now, has this impaired my brain any? I really don't think so. I did rather well in school. We all like good stories, even you do, don't you? In the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, my knowledge of a few good stories to tell the little kids has made me a heroine to the little kids, why not :) ? Why does life have to be so complicated? We have so much to do.
      - Jeff Dixon
        
        If all people did was look at religious texts as stories, then the world would be a different place. However, that is not how people view them. These stories put up barriers between people. They cause to fight and go to war and to kill. Why does the world have to be so complicated? Perhaps because people are unwilling to accept that views that cannot be supported should not be the basis for living life.
      - Esther
        
        If my view (which cannot be supported) is not the basis for how I (really) live my life then, it means I can just enjoy my stories as long as I don't allow them (in other words) to cause barriers between me and people?
      - Jeff Dixon
        
        You can live your life anyway you choose. I am merely voicing an opinion about the dangers that religion can and will cause problems between people. Besides, the issue is not how one person conducts their life. It is about the world getting along better.
      - Esther
        
        Is that a yes or no to my question, Mr.Dixon? I was restating you explanation in the hope that I understood you.
      - Jeff Dixon
        
        It is a yes
      - Esther
        
        Thanks Mr Dixon :)
mallen11

What Roman Catholicism believes and what the Bible says that is the truth:

The bishops, with the Pope as their head, rule the universal Church.
The Bible says: Christ, the head of the body, rules the universal church (Colossians 1:18).

God has entrusted revelation to the bishops.
The Bible says: God has entrusted revelation to the saints (Jude 3).

The Pope is infallible in his teaching.
The Bible says: God alone is infallible (Numbers 23:19; Acts 17:11).

Scripture and Tradition together are the Word of God.
The Bible says: Scripture alone is the Word of God (John 10:35; 2 Timothy 3:16,17; 2 Peter 1:20,21; Mark 7:1-13).

Mary is the co-redeemer, for she participated with Christ in the painful act of redemption.
The Bible says: Christ alone is the Redeemer, for He alone suffered and died for sin (1 Peter 1:18-19).

Mary is the co-mediator, to whom we can entrust all our cares and petitions.
The Bible says: Christ Jesus is the one mediator to whom we can entrust all our cares and petitions (1 Timothy 2:5; John 14:13,14; 1 Peter 5:7).

Initial justification is by means of baptism.
The Bible says: Justification is by faith alone (Romans 3:28).

Adults must prepare for justification through faith and good works.
The Bible says: God justifies ungodly sinners who believe (Romans 4:5). Good works are the result of salvation, not the cause (Ephesians 2:8-10).

Grace is merited by good works.
The Bible says: Grace is a free gift (Romans 11:6).

Salvation is attained by cooperating with grace through faith, good works, and participation in the sacraments.
The Bible says: Salvation is attained by grace through faith apart from works (Ephesians 2:10).

No one can know if he will attain to eternal life.
The Bible says: The believer can know that he has eternal life by the Word of God and the testimony of the Holy Spirit who indwells believers (1 John 5:13; Romans 8:16).

The Roman Catholic Church is necessary for salvation.
The Bible says: There is salvation in no one but the Lord Jesus Christ, “for there is no other name under heaven that has been given among men by which we must be saved” (Acts 4:12).

Christ's body and blood exist wholly and entirely in every fragment of consecrated bread and wine in every Roman Catholic church around the world.
The Bible says: The bread and wine are symbols of the body and blood of Christ, and He is bodily present in heaven (1 Corinthians 11:23-25; Hebrews 10:12-13).

The sacrifice of the cross is perpetuated in the Sacrifice of the Mass.
The Bible says: The sacrifice of the cross is finished (John 19:30).

Each sacrifice of the Mass appeases God's wrath against sin.
The Bible says: The once-for-all sacrifice of the cross fully appeased God's wrath against sin (Hebrews 10:12-18).

The sacrificial work of redemption is continually carried out through the sacrifice of the Mass.
The Bible says: The sacrificial work of redemption was finished when Christ gave His life for us on the cross (Ephesians 1:7; Hebrews 1:3).
- petroskhan
  
  Nicely compiled. Thank you.
- http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=58215905 Wesley Woods
  
  there is no salvation outside of the church for there is no salvation outside of the Lord Jesus Christ and the church is the body and bride of Jesus Christ. John tells us that if everything that Jesus said and did could be recorded there world could not contain the books that could be written. Jesus said the bread was his body and the wine was his blood and Paul confirmed it in his first letter to the Corinthian church. even the Reformers admit that Christ is present when we take the Eucharist. without the Virgin Mary Christ could not be born. Mary is truly the "Mother of God" (theotokos) for she gave birth to the incarnated Jesus Christ. the first bishops were the apostles which we know as saints. James says faith without works is DEAD. Martin Luther admitted that if it were not for tradition he would not know what New Testament books were Scripture.
  - mallen11
    
    Wesley, you believe what the pope and your religion tells you; I believe what the Bible says. There is no salvation with anything connected to the religion of catholicism.
    
    Mary is NOT the mother of God – only the humanity of Jesus – Mary did not form GOD in her womb. Mary had to go through the ritual of purification just like they all did under the Law. See Luke 2:22 Leviticus 12:1-8. She also had other children with Joseph. Matthew 13:55-56 Is not this the carpenter’s son? Is not His mother called Mary, and His brothers, James and Joseph and Simon and Judas? 56 And His sisters
    are they not all with us? Anything added to belief by faith in Jesus Christ for salvation is not salvation but works. Jesus Christ did all the work for our salvation on the cross and then He said "It is finished" and there is no other salvation; no church, no pope, no sacrement, no work will get anyone to heaven except through Jesus Christ.
    
    1 Timothy 4:2-4 by means of the hypocrisy of liars seared in their own conscience as with a branding iron, men who forbid marriage and advocate abstaining from foods which God has created to be gratefully shared in by those who believe and know the truth. For everything created by God is good, and nothing is to be rejected if it is
    received with gratitude;
    
    Acts 4: Nor is there salvation in any other, for there is no other name under heaven
    given among men by which we must be saved.
    
    Wesley, “…Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved.” Acts 16:31There is nothing more you need to do to have eternal life with Jesus Christ.
    - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=58215905 Wesley Woods
      
      so you are saying the Jesus Christ is two different people like Nestorius did right? Catholics do not forbid men from getting married. they just do not believe that married men can serve the flock and God's service effectively. when men become Catholic priest they make the choice to live a life of celibacy. Catholics have a high view of marriage for it represents Christs marriage to the church. the things said the last post were protestant views at the reformation.
      - mallen11
        
        Wesley, your eyes are blinded by traditional religion.
        I totally disagree with your cult religion and there is no reason to continue making comments to you because all you want to do is argue. I have given scriptural reasons to prove that the catholic religion goes against the Word of God but you keep arguing against God's Word. This is my final statement:
        
        I Tim 6:3-5 If anyone advocates a different doctrine and does not agree with sound words, those of our Lord Jesus Christ, and with the doctrine conforming to godliness, he is conceited and understands nothing; but he has a morbid interest in controversial questions and disputes about words, out of which arise envy, strife, abusive language, evil suspicions, and constant friction between men of depraved mind and deprived of the truth, who suppose that godliness is a means of gain.
        
        Titus 3:10-11 Reject a factious man after a first and second warning, knowing that such a man is perverted and is sinning, being self-condemned.
      - petroskhan
        
        Isn't it interesting how you quote Scripture, to someone who claims that he believes in that Scripture, and instead of answering or even acknowledging the Scripture, gives you man-made customs as some sort of "refutation"?
      - mallen11
        
        It is beyond my comprehension.
      - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=58215905 Wesley Woods
        
        all i want to do is point out that the real enemy to protestants is themselves. every time there are disagreements over trivial issues like the age of the earth, what translation of the Bible is best, how women are to dress they split and ignore the ever growing heretical elephants in the room.
      - Despeville
        
        hahhahahaha have you watch the "debate" between your two fellow Roman Catholics "Mafia Joe" Biden and Ryan? Could they be more diverse in their wordlview and religion and on some of the most crucial issues like abortion?
        Of course they could not so there you have it, your myth of Romish unity shattered.
        And that is just a glaring example out of so many.
      - petroskhan
        
        " Catholics do not forbid men from getting married. they just do not
        believe that married men can serve the flock and God's service
        effectively." That is a truly BEAUTIFUL sentiment, Wesley. Really it is. But…umm…that's not what the Bible says. Quite the opposite, actually.
        
        Wes…you do know that a "bishop", defined in the Bible, is someone who is MARRIED, right? With kids?
        
        But of course you do…being a good student of the Bible and all…right?
      - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=58215905 Wesley Woods
        
        so you are saying the God cannot use singles in his ministry? i am not Roman Catholic as you and mallen11 seem to think. i come from a tradition that has married bishops, but i do have great respect for my Roman Catholic brothers for their strong convictions. Paul also told the church at Corinth that he wished others could be single like he was. the only apostle we know was even married was Peter for Jesus healed his mother-in-law. we do not even know if Peter's wife was even still alive at that time. Paul was saying that bishops could not practice polygamy which was wide spread in the first century with virgin girls being spoils of war for the men.
      - petroskhan
        
        Wesley, you're trying to do everything but address the key issue, which is that the RCC is pagan, and of the devil. You want to respect catholics "for their strong conviction"? That is meaningless. Do you respect Richard Dawkins? He's pretty strong in his conviction that God doesn't exist. Got any respect for Charles Darwin? He had some pretty serious conviction. How about a voodoo priest? He's got conviction. Or maybe a druid? Would you respect his conviction? All the examples I gave have two things in common, Wes. They are sincere, and sincerely WRONG.
        
        If all it takes to earn your respect is to be fervent about something, your respect isn't worth much, if it is to be purchased so cheaply. I don't respect catholicism, Wesley, I abhor it. It is pagan, it is satanic, it is WRONG.
        
        If the people to whom you referred are truly your friends, you would try to convince them of the fallacy of their church; you would point out to them how drastically their church differs from what is in the Bible. And maybe stop worrying about "respecting their conviction" and start worrying about their souls.
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100004047180339 John Adams

Why does the pope think he can speak for Christianity? He is a pagan just as much as a head-hunting cannibal in Africa.
- http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=58215905 Wesley Woods
  
  the pope is in the apostolic line of St. Peter to whom Jesus Christ says "upon this rock I will build my church and the Gates of Hell will not prevail against it." Matthew 16:18
  - petroskhan
    
    Wrong. The "rock" to which Jesus referred was the solid, unshakable faith which Peter had just shown. Only those pagan devils in Rome believe that "apostolic line" malarky. News flash – Peter would be horrified to see how his great name and reputation are being so brutally abused by you anti-God, anti-Bible papists.
    
    The pope is an idol worshiping pagan, proven/provable beyond any doubt or contention, and only a fool would deny it or contest it.
    - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=58215905 Wesley Woods
      
      so instead we should worship the city of Jerusalem, the Jews, and the Bible? the Jews we were judged by Jesus Christ for its worship of Jerusalem and the temple. the Bible gets its authority by God not from itself.
      - petroskhan
        
        I'm only asking this due to your post; I don't pretend to actually know you, or even know too much about you, but…are you capable of logic? You know, connecting dots, 2+2=4…that sort of thing? I'm asking because you're tossing out completely irrelevant and illogical answers to what I've said.
        
        The catholic church is pagan. Provable…proven…
        
        That has nothing to do with worshiping a city. Where on earth did THAT come from? And who would worship a religion? You can practice a religion, participate in it…but worship Judaism? Or Jews? You're not making any sense, mate.
        
        And who would worship a bunch of ink and paper? That's what the Bible is. It's ink on paper. Now, the WORDS…they are important. The message of those inkspots on the paper are very important. But the words themselves are not worthy of worship.
        
        And you really need to phrase things a bit more clearly. This sentence:
        
        "the Jews we were judged by Jesus Christ for its worship of Jerusalem and the temple"
        
        makes NO sense. Aside from its obvious (I hope) grammatical errors, the run-on nature of it makes it completely indecipherable. I've no idea what you're trying to convey with that. Are you saying that you're a Jew? You used the "we" right after the word "Jew", so it seems like you must be. But then you say "judged by Jesus Christ for its worship" What is being referenced by "its"? Any explanation would be welcome.
        
        "the Bible gets it authority by God not from itself." Umm…what? God did not give authority to the Bible…it was written at His direction. It's His message and guide to us. Your statement makes it sound like you believe that someone wrote it, then God looked at it, and thought, "Hey, not bad" and put His seal of approval on it, like some beverage company endorsing an athlete. HE WROTE IT, He didn't "authorize" it. It's not his biography, written by a hired author.
        
        Try again. With better grammar and something closer to logical, if it's not too much trouble.
      - mallen11
        
        Petroskhan, there is no reasoning with Wesley. His eyes are blinded to the truth of the Word of God seeking man's ways in his religion and not God's ways. I will no longer respond to his religious ramblings. He totally blasphems what the Bible teaches.
      - petroskhan
        
        True, but there is hope that if enough of the paganism of the RCC is pointed out, it might positively influence someone. I mean, it's not like it's hard to prove Rome wrong, right?
      - mallen11
        
        Absolutely, so keep trying and just maybe the truth will free him from his bondage of religious fallacy.
      - petroskhan
        
        It's usually not for the sake of the catholic person that I point out the rampant paganism in the RCC, but for those who are seeking truth, who might be curious or undecided.
        
        I've found that those who are firmly withing the tentacles of that satanic organization almost never see the truth of their wrongdoing. But sometimes, others, seeking truth, will see the validity of the points raised against catholicism, and realize that the truth they seek is within the Bible, not the teachings from Rome.
        
        For those people, the pokes and prods against catholics, unanswerable by the catholics, tell a great deal about what is of God, and what is of Satan.
        
        And who knows…you might even be able to reach someone like Wesley, if you try hard enough. Just have to get him to actually answer a question, or try to prove a point, instead of spouting off about how great the RCC is, and all that rot.
      - mallen11
        
        You are right. There have been quite a number of Catholic friends in my life that have come to realize the truth of God's Word and are studying it daily under the same minister that we learn from and others have moved and are still in Bible teaching churches. Once the eyes of catholics are opened to the truth, they thrive on the teaching of the Bible and apply it to their lives because they have gone so long without spiritual food for their soul.
        
        Col 2:7 having been firmly rooted (in Bible Doctrine) and now being built up in Him and established in your faith (Bible Doctrine in your soul), just as you were instructed (taught by a pastor teacher), and overflowing with gratitude.
        
        Heb 4:12 For the word of God is alive and powerful sharper than any two-edged
        sword, and piercing as far as the division of soul and spirit, of both joints and marrow, and able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart.
  - Vladimir
    
    In the context of Matthew's account, Jesus had just asked Peter who Peter thought He was. When Peter correctly answered, Jesus told Peter that it was by revelation that he knew Jesus was the Christ, the Son of the living God. It had been revealed to him by His Father which art in heaven. So it is the rock of revelation upon which Christ was building His church, not Peter or any other individual.
  - John Adams
    
    That is an outright LIE!!
    - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=58215905 Wesley Woods
      
      so what is the outright lie; the Gates of Hell not overcoming Jesus Christ's church or or Peter's confession that Jesus Christ is the Messiah, Son of the living God?
      - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100004047180339 John Adams
        
        The lie is that the pope is in the apostolic line.
      - mallen11
        
        John, he doesn't know what the Word of God teaches; only what he is told to believe. He needs our prayers. He is confused.
      - petroskhan
        
        He NEEDS a boot the rear, is what he needs.
      - mallen11
        
        After all the seriousness, thanks for a good laugh.
      - petroskhan
        
        Hey, just remember the old saying, "If you can't laugh at yourself…laugh at someone else!" :P
      - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=58215905 Wesley Woods
        
        there is evidence for apostolic secession in the Bible. Jesus gave the 'keys to the kingdom" his disciples. Peter gives it to at least John Mark as evident in his first letter. Paul gives his to Timothy and Titus. both Peter and Paul died in Rome under the reign of the beast of Revelation Roman Emperor Nero Caesar. Peter was crucified upside down for John makes it clear at the end of his gospel that Jesus predicted that Peter would be crucified. Paul was beheaded for he was a Roman citizen allowing him a more humane way to die.
      - John Adams
        
        The office of Apostle ended at the death of John. The keys to the kingdom is the Gospel.
      - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=58215905 Wesley Woods
        
        i hate to tell you that the apostles have not ended, and i am not talking about the more heretical kind found in the Mormons and NAR. for if apostles ended then no one can be save for who could hear the word if no one was sent to share it. apostles are anyone commissioned to share the gospel lost the lost world; pastors, school teachers, missionaries, even lay people who have taken discipleship classes. the college i graduated from commissions all its students to share the gospel in their professions; doctors, nurses, pastors, lawyers, artists, teachers, businessmen, etc. the keys to the kingdom is Christ's authority that he gave to his disciples who past it on to their disciple continuing throughout the church to this very day.
      - John Adams
        
        The ONLY true Apostles were the 12 selected directly by Jesus, Matthius and Paul.
      - Vladimir
        
        John Adams, I thought the Apostles cast lots to choose Matthius. Jesus had ascended into heaven and is not mentioned as the one who chose him.
        
        The fact that the Apostles chose a replacement for Judas suggests that the apostolic body was to continue. That's not to suggest that it DID continue to this day, but that it was originally designed to be a continuing body.
      - John Adams
        
        One of the requirements to be an Apostle was that the man had to have seen Christ bodily. The Apostle Paul qualified because of his experience on the road to Damascus. However, because of this requirement the ability for anyone to be an Apostle ended with the first century.
      - Vladimir
        
        John Adams, where is that requirement in the Bible? Why do you think there are term limits on apostleship?
      - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=58215905 Wesley Woods
        
        it is in certain protestant doctrine. many protestants redefine apostle to usually anyone who physically saw the resurrected Christ. protestants do not even agree on what constitutes what it means to be an apostle. they just give it such a narrow definition to fit their doctrines and it does not come from the Bible at all.
      - Vladimir
        
        Thank you.
      - John Adams
        
        Act 1:21
        
        Wherefore of these men which have companied with us all the time that the Lord Jesus went in and out among us,
        
        Act 1:22
        
        Beginning from the baptism of
        John, unto that same day that he was taken up from us, must one be
        ordained to be a witness with us of his resurrection.
      - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=58215905 Wesley Woods
        
        these were the requirements that the eleven used to decide who would replace Judas Iscariot. an apostle is someone who is commissioned and sent out. the twelve gave such a commission to Paul and Barnabas by the Holy Spirit.
      - John Adams
        
        Barnabas was not an apostle.
      - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=58215905 Wesley Woods
        
        Luke records that Jesus sent out seventy-two apostles to share the gospel to the lost sheep of Israel. John never gives us the number of Jesus' disciple. Luke in Acts has 120 people praying at Pentecost. the twelve disciples was to illustrate how Christ was recreating the twelve tribe of Israel under the new covenant, but all his followers were apostles. apostle means "sent ones". like said before Paul tells the Romans that none can be saved unless someone is first sent to share the gospel. you are essentially saying that for the last 1900 years no one was able to be saved.
      - John Adams
        
        The seventy were NOT Apostles; they were disciples. The Apostles were a special group of 12.
        Mat 10:2
        
        Now the names of the twelve
        apostles are these; The first, Simon, who is called Peter, and Andrew
        his brother; James [the son] of Zebedee, and John his brother;
        
        Mat 10:3
        
        Philip, and Bartholomew;
        Thomas, and Matthew the publican; James [the son] of Alphaeus, and
        Lebbaeus, whose surname was Thaddaeus;
        
        Mat 10:4
        
        Simon the Canaanite, and Judas Iscariot, who also betrayed him.
        Luk 6:13
        
        And when it was day, he called [unto him] his disciples: and of them he chose twelve, whom also he named apostles;
        
        The Apostle Paul was a special, unrepeatable case.
      - Vladimir
        
        NAR? National Association of Realtors?
      - http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=58215905 Wesley Woods
        
        New Apostolic Reformation
    - Vladimir
      
      Come on, John Adams, he's obviously wrong, but he isn't lying. He's just wrong.
      - petroskhan
        
        No, he is lying. He is making a statement that is false, with evidence readily available that it is untrue.
        
        From Merriam-Webster:
        
        Definition of LYING : marked by or containing falsehoods
        
        Not that I need to define that for you. :D
      - Vladimir
        
        If the person believes what he is saying is true, he isn't lying.
      - petroskhan
        
        Lying:
        (The Free Dictionary)Disposed to or characterized by untruth
        
        (Dictionary.com) the telling of lies, or false statements; untruthfulness
        
        (Merriam-Webster) marked by or containing falsehoods
        
        (Answers.com) Disposed to or characterized by untruth
        
        Try again.
      - Vladimir
        
        Despeville, you've done it over and over in you posts, when someone disagrees with you, you accuse them of lying. Shades of 3rd grade.
        
        If a person knows he is making a false statement, he is a liar. If he believes the statement is truth and represents it as such, he is just wrong. Lying goes to motive.
        
        You have made many false statements about the Mormon church, but I assumed you were deceived and actually believed they were true. Therefore I did not consider you a liar.
      - Vladimir
        
        Actually strike "Despeville". I was answering petroskhan.
      - petroskhan
        
        Okay…right…didn't see this one…well, then, strike that whole first section of MY post.
      - Despeville
        
        A. You are sadly going ad hominem and again…
        B. The truth is ontologically independent from one's epistemological consciousness or to state it plainer the truth is not qualified by motives of presenter. He either affirms it and is with the truth or denies it and therefore is with a lie about that truth.
        C.You were never able to factually address even one of my statements which you can only smear now as you did then without a shred of any factual data.
        D. You are loose and senile talker who likes to talk without bothering to be factual nor consistent in your talks.
      - Vladimir
        
        Despeville, in your world is everyone who states something wrong a liar? I hope you don't go around labeling everyone you know a liar. Because everyone you know and even you have innocently made a statement that is wrong and that makes you and everyone you know liars in your mind.
      - Despeville
        
        You are more senile than I thought Mormon. No wonder you have fallen for your polytheism.
      - Vladimir
        
        I guess you are out of responses again.
      - petroskhan
        
        "Despeville, you've done it over and over in you posts, when someone disagrees with you, you accuse them of lying." First off, wrong name, but you answer a lot of posts, so I'll ignore that one.
        
        Secondly, I don't accuse people of lying simply because they might disagree. I accuse people who tells lies of lying. And I never call someone a liar without proof, as you well know. I called you a liar before, because you lied. You made a claim that I had lied to you, completely unfounded and unprovable; you lied, ergo you're a liar. You also claimed, falsely, that I refused to answer questions, while asking you, repeatedly, to answer mine. Another lie, as I have answered every question I've been asked in this forum, to the best of my abilities.
        
        Lying goes to motive? I don't see that in the definitions I've cited from four different references, do you?
        
        And you want to claim I've made false statements about the Mormon church? Prove it. Prove I've made a single false claim. Or maybe you're lying again?
      - Despeville
        
        Only in your wax nose logic or Mormons :0)
      - Jeff Dixon
        
        Humpty, you purposefully lie all the time.
      - John Adams
        
        I didn't say he was lying or that he was a liar. However, his comment IS a lie. I know he's only repeating what he has heard. He obviously believes the lie.
- Jeff Dixon
  
  Why does the Pope speak? Why does Billy Graham speak? Why does any person claim to know the word of god when the bible has been shown to be changed over time?
Jeff Dixon

http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v=rwnhnag23pQ&feature=endscreen
Esther

If you read ANY Holy Bible you are reading the seeds of Christianity sown by the first Catholics.